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01-18-2018, 06:32 AM
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#101
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Name: DODGEIH
Title: Rookie
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Dec 2017
Location: Glidden Iowa
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselbeef
so bosch never used any inj in a cummins with a vp except the stock ones that cam on my truck? huh...
stick with a vco not an sac and the diff will be more noticeable than pop press differences...
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I don't believe anyone even hinted towards the idea that Bosch only tested 1 injector so idk why you even mention that
Are you speaking from experience? Do you have data or info to support your claim that pop pressure won't be very noticeable? If no, then can I ask again why you're so hesitant to learn more and get more data and real results on the topic?
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01-18-2018, 07:53 AM
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#102
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Name: Signature600
Title: THA MAN!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Jeffersonville, Ohio
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 11,975
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselbeef
so bosch never used any inj in a cummins with a vp except the stock ones that cam on my truck? huh...
stick with a vco not an sac and the diff will be more noticeable than pop press differences...
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I've seen VP pump 12v's, and AGCO Sisu Power engines with VP44's that run a different injector....
I'm not saying that this conversation isn't interesting, but I feel like I've seen it before in about 2006 when VP's weren't quite yet the red headed step child of the Cummins world yet...
Carry on
Chris
__________________
THANKS TO:
Tim Barber @ TRE Diesel
Jeff Mumau @ Mumau Diesel Service
Rip @ Source Automotive
Don Thuren @ ThurenFab Suspension
Columbus Diesel Supply
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01-18-2018, 08:33 AM
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#103
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Name: Carbur8tr
Title: Green Behind the Ears
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2013
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 72
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The density of some here seems to be increasing as this conversation moves forward. I would second the question posted earlier and ask from those of you against the idea, what are you gaining by throwing jabs, what has it gained you so far, and what do you suspect will come of the opposition?
One opacity graph from an emissions test and a good bit of hearsay. We respect results that have been paid for by those who regard this information as their business, but with that said, we who are testing this are also paying for this out of our own pockets and trying to bring information to an area that has always been kept under lock and key.
If you don’t like it then that’s your stance and that’s fine. There’s no need to be offended by the data, videos, and experience. No one is forcing anyone here to take this as the truth.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
__________________
01, 110lb springs, studs, Gen 1 Airdog,60/68/14 non-gated, BD intercooler,DFI 7x.009, HO*VP, Carli 3' coils and control arms, DT ProFab trac bar, Red Head Steering gear, steering stabilizer, maxx links,*08.5 steering upgrade
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01-18-2018, 09:03 AM
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#104
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Name: me78569
Title: Diesel Enthusiast
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2014
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselbeef
so bosch never used any inj in a cummins with a vp except the stock ones that cam on my truck? huh...
stick with a vco not an sac and the diff will be more noticeable than pop press differences...
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I am using vco.
__________________
Bone stock 2018 3500 cclb G56
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01-18-2018, 10:03 AM
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#105
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Name: dieselbeef
Title: dick doggin
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: myakka city florida
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 9,867
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touchy touchy bunch in here..if yer gonna post data be prepared to answer questions and explain..i only ask for things to be explained so I can understand them...
the reason I mentioned the one inj use was because we were talking about larger inj not beng tested in this engine by bosch.
do you think that this is increasing or shortening duration? or no effect at all? as I would assume it must delay the inj cycle right?
__________________
02 quad cab 4x4 aluminum flatbed 63/68/14 hrvp INJ by weston 4.10 gorend/suncoast method race
01 2500 4x4 quad cab all stock/drag comp
07.5 3500 4x4 dually 4 dr 6.7 d&j extreme, fleece cheetah, gorend triple, cat filters,
rip wrongway...
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01-18-2018, 10:24 AM
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#106
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Name: me78569
Title: Diesel Enthusiast
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2014
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 111
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I have tough skin.
So we have rough data to compare in regards to duration, Idle state, in gear, shows ~%2 duration loss at 330 bar, 55 mph cruise state shows ~%2 duration loss as well. I would say roughly %2 is a good guess.
without a doubt it is shortening the length of injection.
__________________
Bone stock 2018 3500 cclb G56
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01-18-2018, 11:53 AM
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#107
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Name: dieselbeef
Title: dick doggin
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: myakka city florida
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 9,867
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so whats pop on a p pump truck
__________________
02 quad cab 4x4 aluminum flatbed 63/68/14 hrvp INJ by weston 4.10 gorend/suncoast method race
01 2500 4x4 quad cab all stock/drag comp
07.5 3500 4x4 dually 4 dr 6.7 d&j extreme, fleece cheetah, gorend triple, cat filters,
rip wrongway...
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01-18-2018, 12:14 PM
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#108
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Name: me78569
Title: Diesel Enthusiast
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2014
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 111
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260 ish
__________________
Bone stock 2018 3500 cclb G56
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01-18-2018, 12:23 PM
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#109
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Name: Signature600
Title: THA MAN!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Jeffersonville, Ohio
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 11,975
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I always ran 300 bar...
Chris
__________________
THANKS TO:
Tim Barber @ TRE Diesel
Jeff Mumau @ Mumau Diesel Service
Rip @ Source Automotive
Don Thuren @ ThurenFab Suspension
Columbus Diesel Supply
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01-18-2018, 12:31 PM
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#110
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Name: FireMed
Title: Clown Puncher
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: indiana
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Signature600
I've seen VP pump 12v's, and AGCO Sisu Power engines with VP44's that run a different injector....
I'm not saying that this conversation isn't interesting, but I feel like I've seen it before in about 2006 when VP's weren't quite yet the red headed step child of the Cummins world yet...
Carry on
Chris
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Is that's about when SAC and micro blinds was the new king on the street and VCOs were stock garbage.
__________________
"01.5" single cab red with red tint
Last edited by FireMed; 01-18-2018 at 12:32 PM.
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01-18-2018, 12:34 PM
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#111
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Name: RonA
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Liberal ground zero.
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 11,058
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smokem
I have seen a few instances where increased opening pressure helped reduce low engine speed smoke, however we found that a higher quality nozzle was a better overall solution to the problem.
I have seen better results from tailoring the specifics to match the end user's goals rather than increase the seat pressure on a production part.
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Excellent!
__________________
55 years of work and all I got was a T-shirt.
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01-18-2018, 12:39 PM
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#112
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Name: Signature600
Title: THA MAN!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Jeffersonville, Ohio
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 11,975
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FireMed
Is that's about when SAC and micro blinds was the new king on the street and VCOs were stock garbage.
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Yeah, I think so...Shortly after Don M posted his findings on that ridiculous 14 hole injector that made the internets explode for a month...
I'm just saying, not that things definitely haven't progressed in 10 years, but your injector is hardly the final place for gains on a VP truck. Lots of other variables and places for much more gains and losses vs a decent quality, "over the counter" VP fire stick.
IMHO,
Chris
__________________
THANKS TO:
Tim Barber @ TRE Diesel
Jeff Mumau @ Mumau Diesel Service
Rip @ Source Automotive
Don Thuren @ ThurenFab Suspension
Columbus Diesel Supply
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01-18-2018, 12:47 PM
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#113
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Name: FireMed
Title: Clown Puncher
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: indiana
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Signature600
Yeah, I think so...Shortly after Don M posted his findings on that ridiculous 14 hole injector that made the internets explode for a month...
ah yes the II 11 hole inj....
I'm just saying, not that things definitely haven't progressed in 10 years, but your injector is hardly the final place for gains on a VP truck. Lots of other variables and places for much more gains and losses vs a decent quality, "over the counter" VP fire stick.
No but it is one that is being presented at this testing and time. Im sure it wouldn't be debated that other factors are to play into this. Ive seen just a VP swap produce better HP..
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In Blue
__________________
"01.5" single cab red with red tint
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01-18-2018, 01:03 PM
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#114
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Name: RonA
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Liberal ground zero.
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 11,058
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Old guys with good memories.
__________________
55 years of work and all I got was a T-shirt.
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01-18-2018, 01:05 PM
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#115
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Name: me78569
Title: Diesel Enthusiast
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2014
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FireMed
Is that's about when SAC and micro blinds was the new king on the street and VCOs were stock garbage.
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Arent builders coming back to vco nozzle these days? Curious.
Really this testing is to figure what higher pop does and present with data. Not looking to reinvent the VP world. It's a dead market.
__________________
Bone stock 2018 3500 cclb G56
Last edited by me78569; 01-18-2018 at 01:08 PM.
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01-18-2018, 01:11 PM
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#116
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Name: Signature600
Title: THA MAN!
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Jeffersonville, Ohio
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 11,975
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FireMed
In Blue
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I would agree...
Quote:
Originally Posted by RonA
Old guys with good memories.
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We're not old Ron...but I can tell you that my memory wasn't what is was then.
Chris
__________________
THANKS TO:
Tim Barber @ TRE Diesel
Jeff Mumau @ Mumau Diesel Service
Rip @ Source Automotive
Don Thuren @ ThurenFab Suspension
Columbus Diesel Supply
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01-18-2018, 01:14 PM
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#117
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Name: paulb
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Klamath Falls, OR
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,673
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RonA
Old guys with good memories.
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I seem to remember someone spending a LOT of time testing 24V injectors.... In a first gen?
__________________
02 4x4 Auto Mach 6+'s, Drag Comp,Source Automotive Twins, Ultimate Transmission
05 2500 4x4 Auto 3.73 BBI 4's, Smarty Touch, Source Automotive Twins, F1 springs and Cam, Opie's bypass system, Mitusa, PPE Dual Fueler, Ultimate Transmission, Opie shafts,Isspro gauges
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01-18-2018, 01:28 PM
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#118
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Name: FireMed
Title: Clown Puncher
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: indiana
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,368
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Quote:
Originally Posted by me78569
Arent builders coming back to vco nozzle these days? Curious.
Really this testing is to figure what higher pop does and present with data. Not looking to reinvent the VP world. It's a dead market.
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Yes that's the trend ive been noticing. Correct, I get what your doing. I like reading through your post here and on other forums. Im an ol vp guy at heart...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Signature600
I would agree...
We're not old Ron...but I can tell you that my memory wasn't what is was then.
Chris
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I would agree with this...
Quote:
Originally Posted by paulb
I seem to remember someone spending a LOT of time testing 24V injectors.... In a first gen?
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I think Ron tested a lot of thing throughout the years..
__________________
"01.5" single cab red with red tint
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01-18-2018, 01:40 PM
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#119
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Name: RonA
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Liberal ground zero.
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 11,058
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulb
I seem to remember someone spending a LOT of time testing 24V injectors.... In a first gen?
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I still have nightmares Paul.
__________________
55 years of work and all I got was a T-shirt.
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01-18-2018, 02:42 PM
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#120
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Name: J-Pipes
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Ohio
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 4,575
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I'm eager to read the updates, just seems like you're overly excited about what you've got so far. For me, if the improvement is miniscule, why risk shortening the life of fuel system that's already considered iffy by many. For me, my current thoughts are to go to a higher quality injector, hopefully a second turbo, and ideally get the v2 tuning to dial it in best I can.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
__________________
2000 Dodge ext cab short bed, 6spd.
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