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02-18-2018, 09:02 PM
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#21
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Name: biggy238
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Just North of Wrong
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 10,867
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That's what I'm after. High RPM high load situations?
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
__________________
Check out @bdmaximusworx
05.5 Campanella White TDi Jetta 5spd 45.5MPG
-Little Sexy
'10 Silver F250 CCLB 4X4 6.4L cummins Swapped
Insta @trash.panda250
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02-18-2018, 10:06 PM
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#22
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Name: ctdthrasher
Title: Green Behind the Ears
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2015
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 77
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Probably more a high rpm thing than load. Although guys do run a stock bottom end to 5k rpm and ~1000hp with decent success. And when it does fail it’s usually a broken ring or rod that ends life.
__________________
98 12V quad cab. PDD 5x14s and 025. 63/68/.83
13.06@103. need more fuel....and air....and fuel
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02-18-2018, 11:52 PM
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#23
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Name: Big Blue24
Title: Comp Diesel Sponsor
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Cedar City, UT
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 6,310
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blackmega3500
Not even during UCC?
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Our UCC truck is a totally different engine build/caliber of truck. It has multiple probes on both the intake side and the exhaust side with full data logger, water injection, multiple water/air coolers, etc. With the solid iron Hamilton block and filled war head, diamond pistons, etc... it's not worth comparing ring gaps, PTW #'s or anything.
The Junker has a wet standard bore 5.9 engine and I've blown the head gasket enough times over the past several years that I've gotten an up close and personal look at cylinder walls, pistons scuffing, etc. It's currently at 010" PTW and 036" top ring gap and it no longer scuffs pistons or butts rings.
I tried to make it clear than it is used hard without regard for EGT with zero instrumentation, and it's a 12v, not a 6.7 with J-jets which may or may not make a difference on piston cooling etc.
__________________
95' 2wd Junker Drag Truck
1502 HP Fuel-Only 12mm P7100 Pump
SXE 472 over GTX55 116mm
OEM 12v Block
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02-19-2018, 12:42 AM
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#24
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Name: ctdthrasher
Title: Green Behind the Ears
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2015
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 77
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Gonna take the top rings to .020-.022 and leave the PTW. If the pistons scuff I may go a different route next time. Will keep updating as the build moves along. Thanks everyone
__________________
98 12V quad cab. PDD 5x14s and 025. 63/68/.83
13.06@103. need more fuel....and air....and fuel
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02-19-2018, 09:15 AM
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#25
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Name: biggy238
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Just North of Wrong
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 10,867
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FWIW, my 6.7 bore is middle of spec on ring gap and 0.010" PTW. I'm curious what it will do.
I was trying to decide whether to pull my rod caps and machine them, but it really seems like I won't be in the operating range where the oil evacuation will be an issue.
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
__________________
Check out @bdmaximusworx
05.5 Campanella White TDi Jetta 5spd 45.5MPG
-Little Sexy
'10 Silver F250 CCLB 4X4 6.4L cummins Swapped
Insta @trash.panda250
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02-19-2018, 10:19 AM
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#26
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Name: ctdthrasher
Title: Green Behind the Ears
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2015
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biggy238
FWIW, my 6.7 bore is middle of spec on ring gap and 0.010" PTW. I'm curious what it will do.
I was trying to decide whether to pull my rod caps and machine them, but it really seems like I won't be in the operating range where the oil evacuation will be an issue.
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
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Is it running yet?
__________________
98 12V quad cab. PDD 5x14s and 025. 63/68/.83
13.06@103. need more fuel....and air....and fuel
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02-19-2018, 12:58 PM
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#27
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Name: joefarmer
Title: MR. Supreme Overlord
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: ohio
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 6,137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctdthrasher
Well hmmmm. Crank is already in. Rings are gapped to max, and these are already .020 over rings and pistons so I can’t buy any larger ones and file to fit. Not sure how far out the gaps will be if I go to a larger bore.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctdthrasher
Gonna take the top rings to .020-.022 and leave the PTW. If the pistons scuff I may go a different route next time. Will keep updating as the build moves along. Thanks everyone
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There's less sealing with the larger gap, but the alternative is not pretty. 0.030" top gap at 800hp will result in ~4oz oil blowby in the 1/4mi. Probably not great for a street truck. 0.020/0.040/0.020 seemed to be reasonable amount of blowby.
__________________
brandon'); DROP TABLE Users;--1948 Dodge 1.5t 12v RH swap | 99 F250 12v RE test rkt | 11 X5 'no soup' | 08 F250 CR RE swap | 05 2500 CR 68 standalone
firepunk.com
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02-19-2018, 01:10 PM
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#28
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Name: biggy238
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Just North of Wrong
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 10,867
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctdthrasher
Is it running yet?
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Nope. I walked over and pet it this morning and told it I still loved it.
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
__________________
Check out @bdmaximusworx
05.5 Campanella White TDi Jetta 5spd 45.5MPG
-Little Sexy
'10 Silver F250 CCLB 4X4 6.4L cummins Swapped
Insta @trash.panda250
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02-19-2018, 09:29 PM
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#29
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Name: ctdthrasher
Title: Green Behind the Ears
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2015
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joefarmer
There's less sealing with the larger gap, but the alternative is not pretty. 0.030" top gap at 800hp will result in ~4oz oil blowby in the 1/4mi. Probably not great for a street truck. 0.020/0.040/0.020 seemed to be reasonable amount of blowby.
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I often wonder about gapless rings, if they would help in a situation like this hard to find info though
__________________
98 12V quad cab. PDD 5x14s and 025. 63/68/.83
13.06@103. need more fuel....and air....and fuel
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02-19-2018, 09:29 PM
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#30
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Name: ctdthrasher
Title: Green Behind the Ears
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2015
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biggy238
Nope. I walked over and pet it this morning and told it I still loved it.
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
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Hmm. So did I haha
__________________
98 12V quad cab. PDD 5x14s and 025. 63/68/.83
13.06@103. need more fuel....and air....and fuel
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02-20-2018, 05:22 PM
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#31
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Name: kleann
Title: VP44 pwr
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Down yonder
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 4,388
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Quote:
Originally Posted by biggy238
That's what I'm after. High RPM high load situations?
Sent from my XT1575 using Tapatalk
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Yes, high rpm. I think a lot of them were running 12v or different brand billet rods with the same bearing clearances as the carrillos so they took a closer look at the rod and noticed how the stock rod cap is skinnier than the rod itself, which is a relief that the carrillos didn't have.
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02-21-2018, 09:49 PM
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#32
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Name: Broaner
Title: Been There n Broke That
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Madison, WI
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 744
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctdthrasher
I often wonder about gapless rings, if they would help in a situation like this hard to find info though
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I've got Total Seal gapless on 2nd position and they seem to do the trick from what I can tell in the ~4k miles so far. I've got a catch can but it sure ain't catching alot on the break in tune. Was seeing 75psi at times on the street but zero events as I was moving last summer. They all landed in the .035-.038 range on their own IIRC. I recall filing only top rings to ~.019". I set tops a bit tighter due to being street oriented. This is on stock bore QSB 6.7 pistons
__________________
05.5 QCSB Shotpeened NV5600 - 994hp/1650tq, 6.7, Wagler Rods, QSB Pistons, 625's, Oversized Valves, ZZFab, P&P, 150%, Dual CP3, 69/73/1.0 & 82/96/1.32
Street Triple, 35's, Trutrac, Carli, MM3 from Gordon, 1100hp
Last edited by Broaner; 02-21-2018 at 09:59 PM.
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02-21-2018, 10:22 PM
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#33
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Name: QMFB
Title: Fastest Welder in Texas
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Corpus Christi, TX.
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,061
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I'm also planning on the total seal second ring on my 6.4 build. From the few people I've heard that have used them (Broaner has been one) I'm confident that they are worth it... At least on a street/DD build.
__________________
04 CCLB DRW - 6.4 Cummins, HPTuners, 80% S&S, 10mm S&S CP3, AD165, s464 /s475, full billet 48re, Arp's EVERYWHERE, mild head work, lots of time and money... And never done.
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02-21-2018, 10:39 PM
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#34
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Name: QMFB
Title: Fastest Welder in Texas
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Corpus Christi, TX.
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,061
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Broaner, it's been a while, but what was your PTW on your build again ?
__________________
04 CCLB DRW - 6.4 Cummins, HPTuners, 80% S&S, 10mm S&S CP3, AD165, s464 /s475, full billet 48re, Arp's EVERYWHERE, mild head work, lots of time and money... And never done.
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02-22-2018, 09:55 AM
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#35
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Name: Broaner
Title: Been There n Broke That
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Madison, WI
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 744
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Can't recall right now. It was a stock bore and machine shop just hit with dingleberry hone.
__________________
05.5 QCSB Shotpeened NV5600 - 994hp/1650tq, 6.7, Wagler Rods, QSB Pistons, 625's, Oversized Valves, ZZFab, P&P, 150%, Dual CP3, 69/73/1.0 & 82/96/1.32
Street Triple, 35's, Trutrac, Carli, MM3 from Gordon, 1100hp
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02-24-2018, 11:08 PM
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#36
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Name: Broaner
Title: Been There n Broke That
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Madison, WI
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 744
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Looked back through my stuff. I ended up at .009 PTW. They went .0065 overbore from the hone and I used stock bore QSB pistons.
__________________
05.5 QCSB Shotpeened NV5600 - 994hp/1650tq, 6.7, Wagler Rods, QSB Pistons, 625's, Oversized Valves, ZZFab, P&P, 150%, Dual CP3, 69/73/1.0 & 82/96/1.32
Street Triple, 35's, Trutrac, Carli, MM3 from Gordon, 1100hp
Last edited by Broaner; 02-24-2018 at 11:12 PM.
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02-25-2018, 09:56 AM
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#37
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Name: QMFB
Title: Fastest Welder in Texas
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Corpus Christi, TX.
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,061
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Thanks Broaner. I was planning on anything in the .006 to .009 area... Sounds good.
__________________
04 CCLB DRW - 6.4 Cummins, HPTuners, 80% S&S, 10mm S&S CP3, AD165, s464 /s475, full billet 48re, Arp's EVERYWHERE, mild head work, lots of time and money... And never done.
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02-25-2018, 10:48 AM
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#38
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Name: Smokem
Title: Turbler
Status: Not Here
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Iowa
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 5,565
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I'm going to make this statement; I do not recommend a total seal 2nd compression ring for street use. Now, this is my opinion based on much of the information available from manufacturers. Capturing pressure between the top and second ring can cause the top ring to lift and increase the chance of premature wear.
Feel free to do as you wish, but be aware of the potential results. Same rule applies for pistons without a steel top ring land, both should be used in dedicated performance applications only.
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02-25-2018, 11:05 AM
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#39
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Name: QMFB
Title: Fastest Welder in Texas
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Corpus Christi, TX.
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,061
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smokem
. Same rule applies for pistons without a steel top ring land, both should be used in dedicated performance applications only.
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Pistons WITHOUT a steel ring land ??.
__________________
04 CCLB DRW - 6.4 Cummins, HPTuners, 80% S&S, 10mm S&S CP3, AD165, s464 /s475, full billet 48re, Arp's EVERYWHERE, mild head work, lots of time and money... And never done.
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02-25-2018, 11:06 AM
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#40
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Name: Smokem
Title: Turbler
Status: Not Here
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Iowa
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 5,565
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Referring to forged aluminum pistons which typically use a hard anodized top ring land.
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