Advertisement
If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

Home Who's Online Today's Posts HP Calculator CompD Gift Shop Mark Forums Read
Go Back   Competition Diesel.Com - Bringing The BEST Together > The Starting Line > Competition Vehicle Build Tech > Extreme Engine Tech
Register Members List Timeslips EFI Live Library Invite Your Friends FAQ Calendar Mark Forums Read

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-18-2016, 09:18 AM   #1
Cozze44
 
Cozze44's Avatar

Name: Cozze44
Title: Junkman
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: WIND GAP, PA
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,315
Waterman Pump Plumbing

So in my build I decided to go with a mechanical lift pump. I had a Sprint Car Light weight Sprint Series pump laying around the shop. This pump is basically the typical Sprint Series pump, just a little lighter. I have searched over and over on how these are being plumbed. I'm finding that I can't seem to find two setups that are the same. I see some people run with a high speed check valve,some with out. Some with a check valve in the pump return to he tank. Some with a regulator, some just a check valve as a regulator. I would like to keep it as simple and compact as possible, with reliability in mind as it will be on the street. I was curious if I can run the pump with a direct feed to the P7100 and have a regulator on the return side of the pump to relieve the excess fuel pressure in the Injection pump case. Any input would be greatly appreciated!
__________________
Frank
03 Subaru Forester - Old man car - 300k - RIP
07 Subaru Forester - Dadmobile - 129k
14 Subaru Legacy Outback - Wifes ride - 70k
02 Dodge 2500
My Build Thread
 
Old 02-19-2016, 07:15 AM   #2
rawdog
 
rawdog's Avatar

Name: rawdog
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jan 2007
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,196
How many ports are on the pump?
__________________
 
Old 02-19-2016, 07:31 AM   #3
Cozze44
 
Cozze44's Avatar

Name: Cozze44
Title: Junkman
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: WIND GAP, PA
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,315
Quote:
Originally Posted by rawdog View Post
How many ports are on the pump?
http://www.watermanracing.com/images...%20Diagram.pdf

This is the diagram from Waterman, however, the way in which it was used on its previous application was with only one high speed check valve. I was thinking about this last night, I suppose it would be the right thing to do to run a highspeed check valve off the pump to prevent deadheading the pump?
__________________
Frank
03 Subaru Forester - Old man car - 300k - RIP
07 Subaru Forester - Dadmobile - 129k
14 Subaru Legacy Outback - Wifes ride - 70k
02 Dodge 2500
My Build Thread
 
Old 02-19-2016, 08:34 AM   #4
97rada
 
97rada's Avatar

Name: 97rada
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 5,410
Sorry for the terrible picture ImageUploadedByTapatalk1455892446.927915.jpg
__________________
Austin
tow truck- 14-3500 with tuning
toy truck -94 rclb auto- 5.2x with a lot left. Shooting for 4s

Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex...it takes a touch of genius- and alot of courage to move in the opposite direction.
 
Old 02-19-2016, 08:38 AM   #5
97rada
 
97rada's Avatar

Name: 97rada
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 5,410
That's what was given to me. I am just trying to figure out my returns now I only want one or 2 returns. Problem is I have one -8 return at the cell and have several returns at the engine.
-6 from waterman
-6 from injection pump
-6 from 3 way dump( with injector return)
Any ideas? I don't know how to weld aluminum to add fittings
__________________
Austin
tow truck- 14-3500 with tuning
toy truck -94 rclb auto- 5.2x with a lot left. Shooting for 4s

Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex...it takes a touch of genius- and alot of courage to move in the opposite direction.
 
Old 02-19-2016, 08:57 AM   #6
Cozze44
 
Cozze44's Avatar

Name: Cozze44
Title: Junkman
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: WIND GAP, PA
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,315
Quote:
Originally Posted by 97rada View Post
Sorry for the terrible picture Attachment 61869
I saw this diagram in 24vboost's thread... The only thing I don't see in the diagram is, the return from the Inj Pump, and also is the "block" in the diagram considered the regulator?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 97rada View Post
That's what was given to me. I am just trying to figure out my returns now I only want one or 2 returns. Problem is I have one -8 return at the cell and have several returns at the engine.
-6 from waterman
-6 from injection pump
-6 from 3 way dump( with injector return)
Any ideas? I don't know how to weld aluminum to add fittings
A manifold would work, or a combo of y's.... No welding required.
__________________
Frank
03 Subaru Forester - Old man car - 300k - RIP
07 Subaru Forester - Dadmobile - 129k
14 Subaru Legacy Outback - Wifes ride - 70k
02 Dodge 2500
My Build Thread
 
Old 02-19-2016, 09:00 AM   #7
Cozze44
 
Cozze44's Avatar

Name: Cozze44
Title: Junkman
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: WIND GAP, PA
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,315
Something like this...

http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Alumin...ting,3258.html
Attached Images
File Type: jpg MANIFOLD.jpg (21.9 KB, 0 views)
__________________
Frank
03 Subaru Forester - Old man car - 300k - RIP
07 Subaru Forester - Dadmobile - 129k
14 Subaru Legacy Outback - Wifes ride - 70k
02 Dodge 2500
My Build Thread

Last edited by Cozze44; 02-19-2016 at 09:08 AM.
 
Old 02-19-2016, 09:09 AM   #8
97rada
 
97rada's Avatar

Name: 97rada
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 5,410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cozze44 View Post
I saw this diagram in 24vboost's thread... The only thing I don't see in the diagram is, the return from the Inj Pump, and also is the "block" in the diagram considered the regulator?







A manifold would work, or a combo of y's.... No welding required.

Injection pump needs a speedy check valve on the return. That's all that's needed. Also the block is just a fuel manifold from haisley.
This is how the system should be ran.
-12/-10 from tank to waterman.
-6 regulated check valve off waterman at 70psi to tank
-10/12 From waterman to filter head
-12/10 From filter to 3 way dump( dump valve is -6 when you dump to tank)
-12/10 From 3 way to y block or something to make dual feed lines to injection pump
From Injection pump to -6 50psi check valve that goes to tank.
Somewhere the injector return needs to tie back in.

My biggest issue is volume of return fuel. I don't know how much fuel the waterman or pump will return. I want to run everything into a -8 return but I am afraid it won't support both the injection pump and the waterman. I think I will Atleast need a -8 and -6 return of not more
__________________
Austin
tow truck- 14-3500 with tuning
toy truck -94 rclb auto- 5.2x with a lot left. Shooting for 4s

Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex...it takes a touch of genius- and alot of courage to move in the opposite direction.
 
Old 02-19-2016, 09:10 AM   #9
97rada
 
97rada's Avatar

Name: 97rada
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 5,410
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cozze44 View Post

If that would support it I would be all about it
__________________
Austin
tow truck- 14-3500 with tuning
toy truck -94 rclb auto- 5.2x with a lot left. Shooting for 4s

Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex...it takes a touch of genius- and alot of courage to move in the opposite direction.
 
Old 02-19-2016, 09:33 AM   #10
Cozze44
 
Cozze44's Avatar

Name: Cozze44
Title: Junkman
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: WIND GAP, PA
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,315
Quote:
Originally Posted by 97rada View Post
Injection pump needs a speedy check valve on the return. That's all that's needed. Also the block is just a fuel manifold from haisley.
This is how the system should be ran.
-12/-10 from tank to waterman.
-6 regulated check valve off waterman at 70psi to tank
-10/12 From waterman to filter head
-12/10 From filter to 3 way dump( dump valve is -6 when you dump to tank)
-12/10 From 3 way to y block or something to make dual feed lines to injection pump
From Injection pump to -6 50psi check valve that goes to tank.
Somewhere the injector return needs to tie back in.

My biggest issue is volume of return fuel. I don't know how much fuel the waterman or pump will return. I want to run everything into a -8 return but I am afraid it won't support both the injection pump and the waterman. I think I will Atleast need a -8 and -6 return of not more
That is a huge help, thank you. So instead of running a regulator you are going to regulate the pressure basically using a relief valve off the pump.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 97rada View Post
If that would support it I would be all about it
I can't see why not. They give you the option of 3 -6 into 1 -10. I think that should move plenty of fuel. I plan on having a the waterman feed by a -10. Out of waterman will be -8. Dual feed -8 to Inj Pump. -8 returns from inj pump and injector ret.

I like the idea of using the check valve to regulate pressure as it seems to be compact and very simple...
__________________
Frank
03 Subaru Forester - Old man car - 300k - RIP
07 Subaru Forester - Dadmobile - 129k
14 Subaru Legacy Outback - Wifes ride - 70k
02 Dodge 2500
My Build Thread
 
Old 02-19-2016, 09:34 AM   #11
97rada
 
97rada's Avatar

Name: 97rada
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 5,410
Waterman Pump Plumbing

Those check valves are 45 bucks. Well worth the money and are clean looking
Also I suggest -10 out of the waterman to the pump.
__________________
Austin
tow truck- 14-3500 with tuning
toy truck -94 rclb auto- 5.2x with a lot left. Shooting for 4s

Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex...it takes a touch of genius- and alot of courage to move in the opposite direction.
 
Old 02-19-2016, 09:41 AM   #12
Cozze44
 
Cozze44's Avatar

Name: Cozze44
Title: Junkman
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: WIND GAP, PA
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,315
Quote:
Originally Posted by 97rada View Post
Those check valves are 45 bucks. Well worth the money and are clean looking
Also I suggest -10 out of the waterman to the pump.
I was going o do a -8 just for ease of doing a y for dual feed, and cause it would make the fittings a little cheaper. You think it would require that much volume to keep it properly fed?
__________________
Frank
03 Subaru Forester - Old man car - 300k - RIP
07 Subaru Forester - Dadmobile - 129k
14 Subaru Legacy Outback - Wifes ride - 70k
02 Dodge 2500
My Build Thread
 
Old 02-19-2016, 11:04 AM   #13
bigstacks95
 
bigstacks95's Avatar

Name: bigstacks95
Title: Diesel Doc
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Falls Village, CT
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cozze44 View Post
I was going o do a -8 just for ease of doing a y for dual feed, and cause it would make the fittings a little cheaper. You think it would require that much volume to keep it properly fed?
I run -8 on my entire supply side with a 13mm Northeast injection pump.

-8 from tank to pump
-8 to filter dual feed to injection pump
-6 from fuel pump to 60psi check valve to fuel distribution block
-6 from transfer pump to 80psi check valve to fuel distribution block
-4 from injector return to fuel distribution block
-8 from distribution block return to tank
__________________
--Dave--

58 Dodge Power Wagon 3.0 Limited Pro Stock diesel pulling truck

2020 Ram 3500 HO/Aisin Laramie/night tow rig
 
Old 02-19-2016, 11:51 AM   #14
97rada
 
97rada's Avatar

Name: 97rada
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 5,410
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigstacks95 View Post
I run -8 on my entire supply side with a 13mm Northeast injection pump.



-8 from tank to pump

-8 to filter dual feed to injection pump

-6 from fuel pump to 60psi check valve to fuel distribution block

-6 from transfer pump to 80psi check valve to fuel distribution block

-4 from injector return to fuel distribution block

-8 from distribution block return to tank

How much run time do you have on this? I really hope it works that well. Where did you get the block? Also did you use a compression fitting on the injector return
__________________
Austin
tow truck- 14-3500 with tuning
toy truck -94 rclb auto- 5.2x with a lot left. Shooting for 4s

Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex...it takes a touch of genius- and alot of courage to move in the opposite direction.
 
Old 02-19-2016, 11:55 AM   #15
Cozze44
 
Cozze44's Avatar

Name: Cozze44
Title: Junkman
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: WIND GAP, PA
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,315
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigstacks95 View Post
I run -8 on my entire supply side with a 13mm Northeast injection pump.

-8 from tank to pump
-8 to filter dual feed to injection pump
-6 from fuel pump to 60psi check valve to fuel distribution block
-6 from transfer pump to 80psi check valve to fuel distribution block
-4 from injector return to fuel distribution block
-8 from distribution block return to tank
Thanks for all your help fellas. Just ordered up a filter setup and the check valves. Ill post pictures as I go!
__________________
Frank
03 Subaru Forester - Old man car - 300k - RIP
07 Subaru Forester - Dadmobile - 129k
14 Subaru Legacy Outback - Wifes ride - 70k
02 Dodge 2500
My Build Thread
 
Old 02-19-2016, 11:58 AM   #16
Cozze44
 
Cozze44's Avatar

Name: Cozze44
Title: Junkman
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: WIND GAP, PA
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 1,315
Quote:
Originally Posted by 97rada View Post
How much run time do you have on this? I really hope it works that well. Where did you get the block? Also did you use a compression fitting on the injector return
B+B tooling makes a nice unit!
__________________
Frank
03 Subaru Forester - Old man car - 300k - RIP
07 Subaru Forester - Dadmobile - 129k
14 Subaru Legacy Outback - Wifes ride - 70k
02 Dodge 2500
My Build Thread
 
Old 02-19-2016, 12:16 PM   #17
97rada
 
97rada's Avatar

Name: 97rada
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 5,410
Does anyone have the thread pitch for the fittings for the waterman ?
__________________
Austin
tow truck- 14-3500 with tuning
toy truck -94 rclb auto- 5.2x with a lot left. Shooting for 4s

Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex...it takes a touch of genius- and alot of courage to move in the opposite direction.
 
Old 02-19-2016, 12:43 PM   #18
CREED1
 
CREED1's Avatar

Name: CREED1
Title: Throwed Off
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Cleveland, Tx
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,880
Subbed..
 
Old 02-19-2016, 01:30 PM   #19
bigstacks95
 
bigstacks95's Avatar

Name: bigstacks95
Title: Diesel Doc
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Falls Village, CT
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 2,030
Quote:
Originally Posted by 97rada View Post
How much run time do you have on this? I really hope it works that well. Where did you get the block? Also did you use a compression fitting on the injector return
Yes I originally had a compression fitting on the return line and it worked fine. Now I have the IH style injectors so its just a barb with a spring clamp. I have 3 seasons on this. The past two, my truck has been competitive and have won a few times, and placed 5th in points for Shootout Productions in 2015.

My fuel junction block came from Speedway Motors. http://www.speedwaymotors.com/Three-...lock,6011.html
__________________
--Dave--

58 Dodge Power Wagon 3.0 Limited Pro Stock diesel pulling truck

2020 Ram 3500 HO/Aisin Laramie/night tow rig
 
Old 02-19-2016, 01:38 PM   #20
97rada
 
97rada's Avatar

Name: 97rada
Title: Too Much Time
Status: Not Here
Join Date: Feb 2008
Member`s Gallery
Posts: 5,410
Mine will be seeing some Driving use this year so we will see what will work and what won't for the returns. I will put a pressure gauge in the return to verify
__________________
Austin
tow truck- 14-3500 with tuning
toy truck -94 rclb auto- 5.2x with a lot left. Shooting for 4s

Any intelligent fool can make things bigger and more complex...it takes a touch of genius- and alot of courage to move in the opposite direction.
 
Closed Thread

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:52 PM.

 


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2006 - 2024, CompetitionDiesel.com
all information found on this site is property of www.competitiondiesel.com