Twin Charged 4BT, Eaton M122, HE341VE

[goose_ss4]

funny question, but making any better mpg?

 

[steed]

How are EGT's with it being already spooled ALL the time? I can't read that gauge LOL

cursing around town its between 4-600, interstate its around 7-800. If I get on it I can hit 11-1200 but all I have to do is take my foot off or give it less gas and it goes down to 600 in seconds.

funny question, but making any better mpg?

I cranked my fuel up so I'm blowing some smoke once I hit 20 psi, I need to bring my star wheel back and see how it does. But right now I'm doing about 20-21mpg estimated. I need to fix my speedo, it bounces around every now and then so my odometer is little off.

I'm driving the truck across country so its going to be interesting to see what I get for MPG over 2800 miles.

 

[Nukem]

For example in my tests I was able to produce 40 psi of boost with as little as 23 psi drive pressure. Upping the drive pressure to 35psi netted no gain in boost.

The main reason for that is the turbo is well off its map and into overspeed at 40psi (3.76PR). Its not making more boost because the additional energy is just being converted into heat and drag!

I learned when I first put it together that at 6CM it wont work.

Why wouldn't it? Compressor surge? The HY30W, HE221W and HE200WG used on the 3.9L and 4.5L ISB have a 6cm turbine and work very well.

O yeah just FYI if you say you experimented with garret turbos that's a VNT not a VGT two completely different turbos with two completely different characteristics.

Actually, no. They do exactly the same thing with an alternate approach.
Like one person using an iPhone and another using an Android, exact same functions but different execution.

 

[steed]

Why wouldn't it? Compressor surge? The HY30W, HE221W and HE200WG used on the 3.9L and 4.5L ISB have a 6cm turbine and work very well.

You don't have a clue what your talking about, and have know real world knowledge of how Holset VGT work.

The reason the VGT will not not work below 9CM is because the VGT uses a sliding wall vane. This wall slides over the turbine, closing or enlarging the size of the exhaust housing.

At 7CM and below the wall is protruding to the extent that the exhaust is restricted blocking free flow into turbine. This restriction is what is know as a exhaust brake. Their are 4 positions which the exhaust brake can be utilized, each position increases the effectiveness of the brake.

Just look at the wall on a VGT, there is small blades on the ends leading up to a solid wall that covers the turbine.

Please stop spreading your worthless information and contribute your own or cited research that has value to the site.

Like one person using an iPhone and another using an Android, exact same functions but different execution.

:umno: all I can say to that is ID10T. :nail:

A full duplex radio is completely different technology. Every Cell Phone uses the same technology. They all rely on the same exact principle as a full duplex radios. Your argument would be the same as saying a Tesla roadster is the same thing as a GT500. both have wheels and both go from A to B. So they must be the same. Hell a Mac Book and PC are more similar then VNT and VGT, they at least use the same X86 architecture.

VNT uses nozzles which restrict the area in which the exhaust can flow. This cases a similar which is known as a Bernoulli Effect. It will channel the energy in a tighter space which will increase velocity of the energy.

VGT turbos use a sliding wall, the wall moves in and out. The performance of this design may not be as great as VNT turbos. However these have less moving parts to brake and maintain.

Like I said prove me wrong,

 

[oldestof11]

He's tormentor. Rage and calling you an imbecile for having a performance diesel will show up.

 

[steed]

I got some good advice from Crazy Carl, I used a Cummins CR tensioner and flipped it to the other side of the supercharger. I also got my 3" pulley, now seeing 3-4PSI idling.

I also ditched my clutch fan, figured its pretty far back from the radiator and I don't have a shroud so its not pulling much if any air though the radiator

With the more wrap and new tensioner, the tensioner doesn't bounce anymore and it don't squeal. I'm still getting a chirp but I think that's coming from my supercharger being misaligned a little. there's a 1/8th of belt that's over the edge of my tensioner. Once I get it pulled back it might stop it.

 

[Nukem]

You don't have a clue what your talking about, and have know real world knowledge of how Holset VGT work.

I'm sorry you feel that way, you simply don't know what you're talking about.

The reason the VGT will not not work below 9CM is because the VGT uses a sliding wall vane. This wall slides over the turbine, closing or enlarging the size of the exhaust housing.

Incorrect, it changes the throat size which changes the exhaust velocity (pressure differential) at any given volumetric flow rate. The exhaust housing size is a fixed size.

At 7CM and below the wall is protruding to the extent that the exhaust is restricted blocking free flow into turbine.

Then please explain why Cummins uses 6cm turbines on their ISB 4's and why it doesn't restrict flow despite using a turbine smaller than your HE300 wheel.

all I can say to that is ID10T.

Ah, personal insults. The last resort for people who have nothing left to argue their point with.

VNT uses nozzles which restrict the area in which the exhaust can flow.
...
VGT turbos use a sliding wall, the wall moves in and out.

VGT/VNT/VTG/VATN/VVT are all trademark names for doing exactly the same thing, changing the throat volume and, thus exhaust velocity, at which the exhaust interacts with the turbine wheel.

Like I said prove me wrong

I already have every time I have posted in this thread, you're just too ignorant to accept the fact you don't understand how variable geometry turbos operate.

You're fixated on the fact I know more than you and you're doing everything you can think of to resist learning something new.

Now, can you grow up or shall you continue to act like a schoolboy brat?

 

[DISTURBED]

Funny I'm having flash backs of another member who was band not long ago

 

[DISTURBED]

I'm sorry you feel that way, you simply don't know what you're talking about.


Incorrect, it changes the throat size which changes the exhaust velocity (pressure differential) at any given volumetric flow rate. The exhaust housing size is a fixed size.


Then please explain why Cummins uses 6cm turbines on their ISB 4's and why it doesn't restrict flow despite using a turbine smaller than your HE300 wheel.


Ah, personal insults. The last resort for people who have nothing left to argue their point with.


VGT/VNT/VTG/VATN/VVT are all trademark names for doing exactly the same thing, changing the throat volume and, thus exhaust velocity, at which the exhaust interacts with the turbine wheel.


I already have every time I have posted in this thread, you're just too ignorant to accept the fact you don't understand how variable geometry turbos operate.

You're fixated on the fact I know more than you and you're doing everything you can think of to resist learning something new.

Now, can you grow up or shall you continue to act like a schoolboy brat?

Well hello tormentor! I see you snaked your way back in here.

 

[oldestof11]

Well hello tormentor! I see you snaked your way back in here.

Called it!

 

[DISTURBED]

Called it!

I just saw where you posted that

 

[steed]

I'm sorry you feel that way, you simply don't know what you're talking about.

Alright man, seems like you know a lot, ill break it down Barney style with videos.

This is a video of a Holset HE351ve off a Cummins 6.7 in a Dodge Ram.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJEk-yYOHpU"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tJEk-yYOHpU[/ame]

Now you ask

Then please explain why Cummins uses 6cm turbines on their ISB 4's and why it doesn't restrict flow despite using a turbine smaller than your HE300 wheel. QUOTE]

Well if you watched the video, you would have seen a demonstration on how the HE351VE works. As the sliding wall protrudes out, you can very easily tell its extending OVER the turbine. This is how Holset designed their exhaust brake. It just so happens mathematically, this coincides with 3CM, 4CM 6CM and 7CM. So that means the Holset HE351VE can only effectively run at 9CM and greater, anything smaller the wall is protruding to the existent your running into the brake.

Now the big question. How does this differ from the 6CM turbos used by Cummins? Hell that's so easy my 8 year old can figure it out. The FIXED geometry turbos don't have a sliding wall protruding over the turbine! its pretty simple, but common since isn't completely common.

VGT/VNT/VTG/VATN/VVT are all trademark names for doing exactly the same thing, changing the throat volume and, thus exhaust velocity, at which the exhaust interacts with the turbine wheel.

:umno: all I can say to that is ID10T. :nail:

X2 oke:

Ah, personal insults. The last resort for people who have nothing left to argue their point with.

Ahh, It’s not a last resort and I mean no disrespect what so over. I am just stating the obvious, for what I do in the military I have more knowledge on how cell phones work then I ever wanted to know. You’re just an ID10T for thinking an android and iphone have different ways they connect to cell phone networks. They use 100% of the same means to communicate, the difference is the OS and user interface the rest but the technology is 100% same. There is no comparison on how VGT and VNT work.

Here’s a videos of the VNT

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gc2awh0O0Bc"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gc2awh0O0Bc[/ame]

This video demonstrates the variable nozzle. How this works is it funnels the energy into a tighter space creating a jet. Imagine taking a water hose and putting your thumb on the edge of the hose. You can then create a jet stream with the water, which will shoot the water out further without any additional energy this is known as the Bernoulli Effect.

Now please explain to me how the VNT is exactly the same as the VGT. The Holset VGT does not use the Bernoulli Effect concept to build boost. It uses a 9CM housing and effectively a built in waste gate by changing the geometry of the housing. The benefit of the VGT isn't quick spool. The benefit is the exhaust brake, with better performance do to 100% of the exhaust going over the turbine.

I already have every time I have posted in this thread, you're just too ignorant to accept the fact you don't understand how variable geometry turbos operate.

You're fixated on the fact I know more than you and you're doing everything you can think of to resist learning something new.

Now, can you grow up or shall you continue to act like a schoolboy brat?

You have just rambled on with nothing, contributed nothing and have proved nothing. I am very open to learn something new, I go out of my way to read and ask questions. If I didn’t I wouldn’t made it as far as I have in the military, I wouldn’t have been able to build my truck, my controller, turbo or my supercharger.

However my one rule to success is I don’t follow the ignorant, you have nothing to teach.

Again :shake:

Like I said prove me wrong,

:lolly:

 

[BramanteCummins]

How this works is it funnels the energy into a tighter space creating a jet. Imagine taking a water hose and putting your thumb on the edge of the hose. You can then create a jet stream with the water, which will shoot the water out further without any additional energy this is known as the Bernoulli Effect.



Now please explain to me how the VNT is exactly the same as the VGT. The Holset VGT does not use the Bernoulli Effect concept to build boost. It uses a 9CM housing and effectively a built in waste gate by changing the geometry of the housing. The benefit of the VGT isn't quick spool. The benefit is the exhaust brake, with better performance do to 100% of the exhaust going over the turbine. :

I think you have it backwards. Vgt changes the orifice size while vnt changes geometry. The "sliding wall" as you call it is much like your thumb on a hose. The vnt on the other hand changes gas projection angle and orifice size.

I strongly disagree with the second paragraph, Vgt is most certainly around because of spool/exhaust pressure reasons. If it were only around because of the exhaust brake why have so many moving parts and such a fancy controller to risk failure?

It's simple really.

 

[steed]

I think you have it backwards. Vgt changes the orifice size while vnt changes geometry. The "sliding wall" as you call it is much like your thumb on a hose. The vnt on the other hand changes gas projection angle and orifice size.

I strongly disagree with the second paragraph, Vgt is most certainly around because of spool/exhaust pressure reasons. If it were only around because of the exhaust brake why have so many moving parts and such a fancy controller to risk failure?

It's simple really.

This might help explain it. Both turbos have different advantages and disadvantages. My argument is due to the design the vgt is only going to effectively build boost at 9cm and greater

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwF_rgqhi8I"]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwF_rgqhi8I[/ame]

 

[JoeCochrane83]

Awesome build man do you have a build thread on the whole truck somewhere else. I was expecting a drag truck when I opend the thread. Than I seen coilovers and a straight axle and started to drool.

 

[steed]

Yeah I do its on 4btswaps.com

Alright guys need some help. Drove from Seattle to colorado springs, blew a brake line, getrag 360 sprang a leak and screwed it up. Then blew a piston ring.

Fixed the brake line, 1k on rebuilding the transmission. Now I need to fix the cylinder, its scored up pretty good you can feel the grooves.

If I rebuild it should I use lower compression pistons? If so what's a good ratio?

 

[TURBOLVR]

I wouldnt drop compression unless you have plans for higher boost levels, like 50+psi. The lower comp hinders starting and low-end power.

 

[steed]

I want to run twins with the super eventually, he341ve with a he351ve.

I'm just trying to figure out the best option right now.

 

[TURBOLVR]

arent those two awfully close in size?

 

[steed]

The he341ve compressor is 52/78 the he351ve is 62/86 both use the same 60/70 turbine.

I don't know if that's to close or not.