4wd suspension that Hooks (Ditching Leaf springs)

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scat

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Aug 6, 2011
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I want to drop as much weight from ditching the leaf spring set up and traction bars it has now and make the wheels actually hook without the violent axle wrap from the massive torque of the motor. Keep in mind though i still will drive the truck on the street occasionally.

I have been wanting to run 4 link rear and front but the major issue i thought about with running 4 link in the front is the geometry of the 4 link system that is designed for a rear axle set up. I know there was a 10.5 outlaw truck what runs a 4 link front but there isn't much information out there about how to get it set up when on acceleration to keep and instant center or keeping it planted and straight.

My second idea was running the 4 link rear but a ladder bar front set up. Simple to do but the part where id like to run it on the street so many people say laddar bars are not much for "flexing" or are too ridged.

A lot to think about for something that isnt tackled everyday but this has been in my mind for quite a while and a few chassis shops i have talked with didn't have a clue about where to go or what to think. Anyone steer me in a right direction or know of anyone to pick their brain about the subject.
 
What is it you are trying to do with the truck? You cant set a full drag truck up to run around the street and vise versa. You have to find a happy medium. The way your talking you want a full on drag truck but still want to take it to Sonic and get your ice cream and stare at the fat c:what:hick.
 
The Biggest plan is to drop weight and control axle twisting. Options are open at the time as to what but running coil overs would make it ride better then lumber wagon leaf springs. Everyone has different feelings on streetable too. Ideas are my main goal to expand from.
 
JJeepyjohn said:
The way your talking you want a full on drag truck but still want to take it to Sonic and get your ice cream and stare at the fat chick. :what:
Click to expand...

The closest sonic is 70 Miles so yes, and i can only hope there are fat chicks to stare at too!
 
Rear four link or ladders are completely streetable. Although with heim joints etc, it will make a little noise. There are quieter heims, but I would just run the noisy ones.

A ladder setup is easier for most guys to tune and will have less maintenance.

Unless you dramatically lower the truck, you will need to build a sub cage below the frame to make your front connecting points. For a drag type application you want your bars almost parallel to the ground. It's different when we're talking off road trucks.

In the first pic the rear is just bolted in for mockup. The bars aren't in their final locations, that comes once the truck is built and scaled.

But as you can see, at this point the lower bar is nowhere near parallel to the ground. So in my application I need to move the rear end upward, in other words lower the vehicle.

Now before I get flamed, the setup will not end up parallel to the ground, but its not that far from it. So, suspension gurus, don't bust my balls for using that term.U have to measure and find the instant center for your application to determine your bars exact positioning.

[ame="http://s81.photobucket.com/user/Garret83/media/LIL%206BT/K%20Rides/Co2.jpg.html"]Co2.jpg Photo by Garret83 | Photobucket[/ame]
 
Now in this second pic you can see where the bottom of the front four link brackets are just barely below the factory frame. This is with an extremely low truck.

A taller truck would require the front four link bracket to be dropped proportionately.

Now, I know plenty of guys who have not setup the angles correctly and get much better launch and axle control than a stock setup, but they are not using the four link to its full potential.

[ame="http://s81.photobucket.com/user/Garret83/media/LIL%206BT/K%20Rides/5.jpg.html"]5.jpg Photo by Garret83 | Photobucket[/ame]
 
The truck sits this low, to make the setup work correctly.

[ame="http://s81.photobucket.com/user/Garret83/media/Houston%20DHRA%2007/Abby%20DHRA%2007/DHRAHouston024.jpg.html"]DHRAHouston024.jpg Photo by Garret83 | Photobucket[/ame]
 
An example of a taller truck that I can think of is Jimmy Smiths Maroon truck.

Even being a lowered 4x4 it had a subcage setup if I recall correctly. I haven't looked at it in years though. So I could be mistaken.
 
Crawler said:
Here are a couple links to the Smith truck. As you can see the suspension pickup points are dropped.


http://www.dieselpowermag.com/events/0812dp_2008_scheid_diesel_extravaganza/photo_26.html

http://www.dieselpowermag.com/events/0906dp_redneck_nationals/photo_17.html
Click to expand...

Thats what i had in mind on the rear. The biggest concern is getting the front set up with bar angles and such. Would i just be better off with a standard parallel 4 link to get the axle fixed or would it hold me back from tuning it out on launching?
 
Honestly I never really went beyond shortened links at the stock mounting locations and coilovers.

I'm not sure what the big boys are running now, as I haven't gone to a Diesel event in a long time.

I built a bunch of low 11 second 4x4 and they ran stock front suspension and caltracs in the rear. But they weren't 1st gens.

On the front of the high 10 second 4x4 common rail I built, we had custom fabbed tubular bars in the factory location, but the lengths were custom for the lowered rideheight of the truck. It did well on launch, if we'd put more power to it, who knows how it would of acted.
 
Leaf springs on 4x4 can hook if you spend some time tuning them. Trust me. Ive been there.
 

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I built some traction bars. 3 Leafs in the rear. 5 degrees pinion angle. Front limiting straps (due to coils kept popping out of the buckets under a hard launch). Soft rear shocks and good 90/10 front shocks. Played with tire pressure and roll out. Just takes time and patience. Sorry I don't have pics. Just the ones in my head.
 
Bponci said:
Leaf springs on 4x4 can hook if you spend some time tuning them. Trust me. Ive been there.
Click to expand...

I know leaf springs will get me there but Ive always wanted to try something newer with a older style 4 wheel leaf spring suspension system. As of now my biggest concern would be the front suspension with the weight of the truck with 2 leafs (where my ride height is now) and a hard launch. Ive seen Coles truck in a few videos all over the place on a launch but he has 5 or more leafs I believe and sits higher then where i am now. I should add that i want to do this with a 29 x 10.5 DOT slick.
 
Bponci said:
Leaf springs on 4x4 can hook if you spend some time tuning them. Trust me. Ive been there.
Click to expand...

I agree. Heck, when I took project x down to Houston in 06; I cut 1.67-1.69 60s. Two wheel drive stock springs in front, rear with only two leafs, tuned shocks, and off the shelf caltracs really dialed in. Ran the MH Racemaster radials on it.

So no doubt that leafs work in the rear. But I also understand the OP really wants a four link. To each their own.

I'm building a single cab street toy now and I'll keep leafs in the rear on this one. I just like it better for the street. It takes the potholes and abuse better, pluss the ground clearance is greater.


[ame="http://s81.photobucket.com/user/Garret83/media/Project%20X/20527.jpg.html"]20527.jpg Photo by Garret83 | Photobucket[/ame]
 
scat said:
I know leaf springs will get me there but Ive always wanted to try something newer with a older style 4 wheel leaf spring suspension system. As of now my biggest concern would be the front suspension with the weight of the truck with 2 leafs (where my ride height is now) and a hard launch. Ive seen Coles truck in a few videos all over the place on a launch but he has 5 or more leafs I believe and sits higher then where i am now. I should add that i want to do this with a 29 x 10.5 DOT slick.
Click to expand...

If you're set on four link then build a front and a rear subframe and four link them both properly.

Can you do the fab or would you farm it out?
 
I have some QA1 shocks in the rear ( single adjustable ), but where can I find some good 90/10's for the front. Should I just get measurements and order some that fit my range?
 
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