diesel engine <200kg/440lb >220HP

D

DeepB

New member
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
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5
Hi,

i am thinking about building an airplane.
it should be diesel powered, and the powerplant should have 200kg/440lb or preferably less, with at least 220hp at approx 3000rpm.

what engine would be an option for me?

best regards
Daniel
 
An air cooled deutz would probably be the lightest but I'm not sure on HP.

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Nevermind, 200hp deutz is over 1000lbs. Maybe a modded tdi?

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Diesel engines are heavier by design than gas engines and the power to weight ratio is not idea for an aircraft. A VW 1.9 R4 TDI is around 440 lb. but only comes with 110 hp in the euro version. There is no way I see it running a continuous 220hp@3000rpm during take off and staying cool. In a vehicle peak power is only realized for a short time as the engine accelerated through the power band. In an aircraft peak power is required until cruising altitude is reached which can be quite an extensive time. Compared to a Lycoming O-360 or Lycoming O-540 a diesel leaves alot to be desired...just my opinion.


[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Volkswagen_Group_diesel_engines"]List of Volkswagen Group diesel engines - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

Lycoming O-360 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Lycoming O-540 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
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Wouldn't touqe be more important in a aircraft? Just run a steeper pitch propeller? I know nothing about aircraft so this is just a guess.
 
I have a few realatives that have owned small aircraftand currently fly. A 1959 piper commanche weighs in around 1400lb and has an 8.1L 250hp rated engine similar to the lycoming. I have rode in one and have seen first hand what that motor goes through...no way I would consider replacing a 8100cc motor with a 1900cc motor! Airplane motors are designed to stay together. They have 2 ignition systems, a diesel only has one injection system. Due to major temp changes from ground level to 10,000+ft air cooled engines are better...no cooling system to spring a leak, no radiators to catch flying debris.
 
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DeepB, hello and welcome to Competition Diesel! Sounds like a very interesting project idea that you have going. What size/ type of airframe did you have in mind to put the diesel into?
 
Hi,

I am thinking about building a [ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cozy_MK_IV"]Cozy MK IV - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame] Canard Pusher Aircraft, but a little bit stretched to accomodate the higher weight of the engine.

I am not sure to take a diesel, just thougt about it for a few reasons:
* more MPG
* more reliable, especially if run at lower RPMs
* thought no redrive needed
* not as flammable (think crash)

I am not shure if it is really doable and if I'll do it, just thinking about the idea.

best regards
Daniel
 
LReiff said:
no way I would consider replacing a 8100cc motor with a 1900cc motor! Airplane motors are designed to stay together. They have 2 ignition systems, a diesel only has one injection system. Due to major temp changes from ground level to 10,000+ft air cooled engines are better...no cooling system to spring a leak, no radiators to catch flying debris.
Click to expand...

Yes, i know that cooling will be a challenge. But there are many gasoline auto-conversions flying, some for far more than 1000 hours. so the cooling is doable, and if I use an engine that is a little oversized, so I don't run it at full power it should really be no problem (again, many gasoline auto conversions flying).

Yes the Aircraft engines are built for this, but they are more than 60 years old. Lycoming or Continental build the same engines they built 60 years ago. they are not fuel efficient and lack many modern features. They cost A LOT and if you have to overhaul them that costs nearly as much as a new engine. then the 50 and 100 hour checks which also cost half a fortune.

As mentioned, there are many auto-conversions flying (mostly ford and chevy afaik), and i thought why not try this with a diesel.

best regards
Daniel

EDIT: there is a COZY MKIV with an Lycoming O540 flying, so any diesel engine that i'd use would have to compete with an O-540.
 
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Hi there DeepB, there is one engine that fits all of your design parameters out there thats currently under development by an outfit from Wisconsin. I remember running across them while doing some searching for a lightweight diesel for a different project, they're still trying to get their FAA certification on the engines but it looks like they'll be selling into the general aviation marketplace. iirc they have one engine thats about 200HP/350lbs. Check out DeltaHawk industres, I imagine they're pretty pricey but it might be what you're looking for.
 
A diesel is doable in a bigger plane . I am currently working with a friend who has a 5.9 Cummins in a bi plane . It was a crop duster so he says it can handle the extra weight, but this is just a play toy/test plane ! We shall see wat happens this weekend....
 
I used to make a few parts for place called Barnett Rotorcraft. Little wingless helicopter looking gizmo's with a prop at the rear and a non powered rotor for lift. They used Subaru car engines and ran very well. Might check the weight versus power on those and look for a comparable diesel. Flying is flying until it becomes falling.
 
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