Stock 6.0L diesel cylinder head flow numbers.

hpprose said:
Actually on that note, would be interesting to know the Cummins' exhaust flow. The intake is close to the same, what about the exhaust? I would assume it is much higher than our 12X.
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Did you happen to get this number?
 
PSDPlayer said:
My Stage one manifold removes all of the internal restriction and adds some volume to the plenum. I want to port the heads and run them on a truck to compare them.
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What is the difference between your stage 1 and stage 2
 
Stage one bolts on and leaves the alternator in the stock location and maintains the stock appearance. Stage 2 is all out individual runner with box plenum.
 
WAO Racing said:
Have you got us a picture of the stage 2 yet?
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Its only in my laptop in Solidworks so far. I have been playing with different size tubes down to the head ports. I need to try something on the head before i finalize it.
 
Do a screen grab in Solidworks and post what we are talking about.. What benites are we expecting for stage 2?
 
Robts said:
Do a screen grab in Solidworks and post what we are talking about.. What benites are we expecting for stage 2?
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why would he do that prior to being completed and patented? So you engineers can fab it up yourself and beat him to the punch?

:redx: is what you get.
 
Just felt like the thread started to get to far away......Needs to be updated with some new news anyway.
 
SINNER said:
I think you mean 28" of water column, as in a pressure rating. And not 28" vacuum, as in a negative pressure test.
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Why couldn't it be vacuum? The way those units work, they pull vacuum from under the head (equivalent of the cylinder) and they have an electronic flow meter hooked up somewhere in the loop. The computer moves the valve to the 1st position and waits for the flow number to equilibrate. The computer records that number, then moves the valve to the next position, etc.

And...it is 28" of vacuum. 28" of water is about a 1psi vacuum (not much). So keep in mind that the flow number is pretty meaningless because under normal operating conditions, the pressure differential is much more (therefore, the flow is much more). And that...is why it is important to get before after numbers. It gives you an estimate of the relative change. Like 20% more flow or whatever.
 
how can vacuum ever equal psi? vacuum is a measure of a lack of psi. So no measure of vacuum could ever equal 1 psi. vacuum is measured in inches of mercury, not water.
 
Vacuum is a measure of pressure relative to ambient pressure. Many units of measure exist for measuring pressure. For EVERY measurement of pressure, the same units can be used for vacuum. For example, it can be any fluid. Each fluid has a different density, therefore the head (height of liquid equal to that pressure) depends on the fluid. So, we know that ~30 inches of mercury = 1 atm, or ~15 psi. But we also know that about 30 feet of water is also equal to about one atm. Denisty is the only difference, and mercury is about 12 or so times as dense as water.

As far as vacuum goes, it is really a misnomer. We call it vacuum because it is a pressure lower than what we experience as atmospheric pressure. In reality, a much easier way to look at it is on an absolute basis. If you look at a pressure gauge, it reads zero when exposed to the room you are in. Just like the boost gauge on our trucks. In reality, they are set to zero, but there is really 14.696 psi pushing on the gauge (0psig = 14.696psia). So, vacuum is an artificial idea to show us what the pressure is relative to ambient pressure. And because we can use many units for pressure, including psi, mmHg, inches of water, pascals, kg/m^2, etc, we can take any of them and convert a certain level of vacuum to any of those units. For example:

If you hook up a vacuum pump to a gauge and adjust until you see 13.696psia (absolute pressure where 0 psi is really 0, nothing present, you could not breather, etc....like outer space), you will have reduced the pressure by 1psi from ambient. Pulling 1 psi of vacuum is the same as:

0.068 atm
0.070 kg/m^2
51.7 mmHg (millimeters of mecury)
2.04 inches of Hg
27.68 inches of water ~28

So, you could say you pulled 1 psi of vacuum or 28 inches of water vacuum; same thing.
 
PSDPlayer said:
Since the Heui injector has a tough time firing a second time for say a post commbustion injection it needs to find a way to mechanically reduce hydrocarbon emmissions. Where as the Dmax guys can use EGR to reduce oxides of nitrogen and a post combustion fuel injection to reduce hydrocarbon emissions.
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The 6.4 doesn't have HEUI anymore. Is the 6.4 cam different than the 6.0? Does it give a cleaner intake charge? Can a 6.4 cam be put in a 6.0 and then get some kick ass tuning for it? :st:
 
All of this discussion just gave me a question. I do have a flow bench and have spent some hours on it developing various racing heads. I pull air through the intakes and push air through the exhausts. Here comes my question. Being that the turbo diesel is making boost when under power, wouldn't it be proper to push air through the intake valve from the port for flow developing heads?
And ,yes, inches of water is appropriate term. It is how far a column of water is pulled or pushed in the glass tube of a manometer.
 
The CFM of the head would deffinately higher under pressure. But if some race heads were flowing say 335cfm at .700, we have a long way to go.

6.4L cam has a little higher lift on one of the lobes. But huei vs cr isn't a determining factor in profile. More for EGR flow and emmisions characteristics.
 
misterc said:
All of this discussion just gave me a question. I do have a flow bench and have spent some hours on it developing various racing heads. I pull air through the intakes and push air through the exhausts. Here comes my question. Being that the turbo diesel is making boost when under power, wouldn't it be proper to push air through the intake valve from the port for flow developing heads?
And ,yes, inches of water is appropriate term. It is how far a column of water is pulled or pushed in the glass tube of a manometer.
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In my opinion, if your set up can accomodate it, I would test intake and exhaust flow characteristics under pressure (I think that is what you are asking). If you really want to get fancy, you can mimic the actual inlet T and P to get an exact match.

Having said all of that, the simple man's approach probably works just as well, and that is, use a fixed pressure drop (like 28 inches of water, or whatever) and keep playing with the geometry of the heads, polishing, etc., until you maximize the flow.

Testing a higher pressure drop has a definite advantage though. The flow readings get magnified, so you will see the effect of geometry changes and polishing more clearly, say, if you ran at a 10psi delta P (~280 inches of water), than if you ran at a 1psi delta P (~28 inches of water). So maybe an intermediate solution is to just run more delta P.

In my opinion, it does not matter if you run 10psi of pressure (on the inlet side) or 10psi of vacuum (on the cylinder side). You will get very similar flow readings.
 
Heres some numbers from Banks Diesel I thought were interesting. I couldnt find the numbers Machinist(?) results posted for stock either.

http://www.powerstroke.org/forum/1061663-post30.html

Intake port...

.000 Lift 0 CFM
.050 Lift 41.4 CFM
.100 Lift 80.4 CFM
.150 Lift 119.9 CFM
.200 Lift 145.4 CFM
.250 Lift 152.0 CFM
.300 Lift 154.8 CFM
.350 Lift 157.4 CFM
.400 Lift 159.3 CFM
.450 Lift 161.0 CFM
.500 Lift 161.9 CFM
.550 Lift 163.0 CFM
.600 Lift ----------

Exhaust Port....

.000 Lift 0 CFM
.050 Lift 37.0 CFM
.100 Lift 69.9 CFM
.150 Lift 93.2 CFM
.200 Lift 106.1 CFM
.250 Lift 111.2 CFM
.300 Lift 116.8 CFM
.350 Lift 119.2 CFM
.400 Lift 120.7 CFM
.450 Lift 121.3 CFM
.500 Lift 121.9 CFM
.550 Lift 122.3 CFM
.600 Lift 122.7 CFM

Tested at 28"
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dunno how that compares to dougs numbers
 
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