Automatic vs Manual

I never said that heat from spooling wasn't the issue! The heat was melting the linings off the converter as I said in a earlier post. You should really read before you post! I never said the truck is any force of nature, however it does tear up transmissions! There are some of the pro diesel trucks running clutches in front of an autos or lencos. That is where that class is headed. It's what were doing. I don't really need any suggestions from you, like I said before I was stirring the pot. I like to see you get all uppity, like your the god of comp-d. It amuses most of us!
 
hummin cummins said:
I never said that heat from spooling wasn't the issue! The heat was melting the linings off the converter as I said in a earlier post. You should really read before you post! I never said the truck is any force of nature, however it does tear up transmissions! There are some of the pro diesel trucks running clutches in front of an autos or lencos. That is where that class is headed. It's what were doing. I don't really need any suggestions from you, like I said before I was stirring the pot. I like to see you get all uppity, like your the god of comp-d. It amuses most of us!
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No, what you like to do is walk into a thread like your truck is some kind of unstoppable force, that operates outside the capabilities of an automatic trans.

When in reality you just can't get the pig to spool and melt the poor trans before the tree ever even starts down.

So in a thread about autos vs manuals.... does this mean you're going to stab an NV4500 in there and show everybody how it's done?

Or......???


I can't make the connection between the fact that you can't build boost at the line to save your life and whether or not an auto is better than a manual?




Here's your first post in the thread:

hummin cummins said:
Charles, enlighten me on what to do if an auto will NOT hold up behind a 12v.Not even for one 1/8 mile pass.
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My answer was get yourself a better trans. That didn't seem to do it for you, because...

hummin cummins said:
We are way north of a 1000hp on fuel and we are running a 47re. I am not going to mention the builder because I am very happy with all of their efforts to try and cure the problems, but it has just become to uneconomical to keep shipping converters every week and rebuilding the unit every time you made a pass. Plus the last pass we made with it last season, the tranny fluid boiled out the dipstick tube and shot out the onto the exhaust manifold, catching the engine bay on fire at 100+mph at the 600ft mark.
as far as breaking parts there was none, but we would melt the linings off the converter and literally weld the forward and OD clutches together. I had a 4 row 18x24 staab oil cooler on it with a 18'' spahl fan. Oh and we could spool in under 15 sec.
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So.... get yourself a better trans and do something about the fact that your tone seems to suggest that you think 15 seconds is acceptable?

You're an unquenchable problem. Nothing anyone can do to help you, least of all me.

But if it makes you feel better to pretend I'm impractical because I can't tell you how to make a dodge pickup truck trans hold up to drag racing that involves over 10 seconds of converter abuse before you even deep stage, then by all means, continue.
 
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Charles said:
If I had to venture a guess I'd say you're destroying the converter at the line trying to spool and the engine power has little to do with the problem.

And go easy on all the laughing emoticons. All the gasser guys making pass after pass after pass that see guys like you unable to keep transmissions together for a single pass at 1/3 the power output are running low on em as it is.

--------------

In my best "gas station guy from Tommy Boy" voice...

Get yourself a better trans.
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My thoughts as well for both the problem and the fix.
 
Is a lenco not a manual? You leave with a clutch, manually shift it or air shift, just no need to use the clutch to do so. Yes I know it's not a NV4500, NV5600, ZF or even a M21/22.

It builds boost fine for what it is it and no connection, just messing with you! Don't take offense everybody does it.
 
hummin cummins said:
Is a lenco not a manual? You leave with a clutch, manually shift it or air shift, just no need to use the clutch to do so. Yes I know it's not a NV4500, NV5600, ZF or even a M21/22.

It builds boost fine for what it is it and no connection, just messing with you! Don't take offense everybody does it.
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My 4R100 is a manual by that logic.

The way I define automatic is the ability to apply the next gear under full throttle without having to release the first gear before applying the next, even for a microsecond.

That's auto.

Whether you want a converter, slider clutch, magnetic clutch, or anything else you can think of, if it's got staged planetaries to perform the shifts sequentially, that's auto in my book.
 
Charles said:
My 4R100 is a manual by that logic.

The way I define automatic is the ability to apply the next gear under full throttle without having to release the first gear before applying the next, even for a microsecond.

That's auto.

Whether you want a converter, slider clutch, magnetic clutch, or anything else you can think of, if it's got staged planetaries to perform the shifts sequentially, that's auto in my book.
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Libraries are full of books, apparently we have different ones.
 
hummin cummins said:
Libraries are full of books, apparently we have different ones.
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So my PCS controlled 4R100 is a manual transmission then?


Maybe you'd like to confer with your "books" some more and get back to me. Or.... you could accept that my definition is correct given the current context.
 
Can you put the 4r100 in rev or drive without applying the clutch? Can it com to a complete stop while in gear without applying the clutch? Can you put gear oil in the 4r100 or does it take AUTOMATIC trans fluid, because my planetary style transmission uses gear oil like a manual. Petty I know but the fluid says it all.
 
hummin cummins said:
Can you put the 4r100 in rev or drive without applying the clutch?
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Um, every manual trans I've ever owned could be shifted into any gear you wished as long as the clutch was not applied. As the input shaft would be sitting still...

Just as is the case when the clutch in my converter is not applied. You can shift to any gear you wish.

Now if you apply the clutch on a manual by releasing the pedal then you can no longer shove it in gear without stalling the engine as was the case with my ZF6.

Same goes for my 4R100. If I apply the clutch sitting still and stick it in gear it will stall the engine just the same.




Can it com to a complete stop while in gear without applying the clutch?
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Obviously. If the converter clutch is not applied the trans can come to a complete stop in any gear you wish. If the TCC is applied however, you can't stop the M'fer short of two-footing the brakes and stalling the engine.

Exactly the same as it was for my ZF6.



Can you put gear oil in the 4r100 or does it take AUTOMATIC trans fluid, because my planetary style transmission uses gear oil like a manual. Petty I know but the fluid says it all.
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I cannot run gear oil in my 4R100. Course I couldn't run it in my ZF6 either because my 4R100 runs the exact same "automatic" transmission fluid that my ZF6 manual did...



Did you have some point to all that, or were you hoping to prove that my 4R100 is just as manual as my ZF6 was based on your definition?

Ready to accept that my definition is more appropriate yet?
 
hummin cummins said:
Is a lenco not a manual? You leave with a clutch, manually shift it or air shift, just no need to use the clutch to do so.
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My understanding is that they can be set up with either a converter or a clutch. My personal experience with them is limited however, as the more traditional "automatics" work just fine for the applications I deal with.

Charles said:
So my PCS controlled 4R100 is a manual transmission then?


Maybe you'd like to confer with your "books" some more and get back to me. Or.... you could accept that my definition is correct given the current context.
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Your definition is the same as what the sanctioning bodies would use.

An automatic transmission with a full manual valve body is still an automatic.
 
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