Advantages of p-pumping

Yep, you will need a cam sensor bracket from haisley. It requires you to ream the timing pin hole about and inch to one side. Bolts up pther than that.
 
True, but 800hp vp on fuel is a hard thing to do. Even then I doubt the pump would last very long. Mine has it issues with the weather and Im not near 800.
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For the last couple of years I have had the best seat in the house watching Jetpilot attempt to destroy 24v's.Even when the old black Jetracer truck that Signal73 now owns was a VP truck it was consistently ran well into the high 700's on nitrous.His wifes grey truck which PDW Power has been trying to sell has been into the high 700's and has gone better than 630 on a single charger on fuel with a VP44.Offshoreracr's very potent dually runs well into the high 6's on fuel and will lay an easy high 7 with giggle gas and a VP44.

Again,these trucks benefit from the ease of tuning and being able to take advantage of the weather with a switch flip.Hard running VP44's can take daily abuse and still do well in competition.Jetty's wife's old grey truck,owned by PDW,is still being driven around on the same pump Doug laid down 632 on fuel and 750+ on spray with a single charger.Doug's old black truck was driven to PDR after we laid down numerous 750+ runs doing injector testing and then he had Piers p-pump it.I'd bet if you ask him now about the P-Pump conversion he would tell you what he has said to others at many of our shows,he would not do it again.

To attain 800 on fuel with a 24v,even P-pumped.I pale to think how much money you need to do that because its going to take more than just a pump.I'd still take a stout running 24v for tuning ability over the same hp equipped p-pump truck any day,and I am a p-pump owner.....Andy
 
You would need nitrous to make more than 700hp on a vp truck without a doubt correct?
 
I dont want to hit 699hp with my vp truck and be told the only way to make more power is nitrous. Im not a big fan of nitrous and I dont want it to come down to that.
 
I will never say that my truck is more street friendly after the swap. For daily driving I miss the VP. The great thing with them is that they can adjust for weather. All the P-pump know is run, RUN HARD, off. The problem I have with the VP's is that they WILL quit.

They're many high HP VP trucks on the road, and many racing. But, once you hit 800 ON FUEL or 4K rpm thats it. The p7100 will go past that, so will a CP3 but that another thread.

Ive read several of Doug's posts on the subject. Ive also heard that he was trying to tune a 13mm on that truck. I personaly have no experience with a 13mm but what Ive gathered they are picky.

For my power level a VP could do easy, I killed 4 on the way. But look at a certain 398hp VP truck on here. Thats what I wanted away from.

The monster VP's seem to be changing things but its still debatable.
 
I have driven my truck twice in the last 3 months. Streetable is not an issue for me. Power,Power, and more Power is all I care about.
 
smoken02 said:
I have driven my truck twice in the last 3 months. Streetable is not an issue for me. Power,Power, and more Power is all I care about.
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Your money, your call.

Ive grown bored with 474, 800ish is my next step, 1100+ after that. Thats one of the reason's I done it. And 4500 sounds soooo sweeet.

I look at the glass like this: All the fastest cummins power vehicles except schied's have p-pumped 24V's. They are no VP mod trucks. There is a reason.
 
well if anyone reads diesel power mag. the aug. issue has a nice article. Its a 99 24valve with vp pump. Made 807hp and 1564lb on fuel only. List of mods inclue. balanced and blueplrinted bottom end, common rail marine pistons and industrail rods, main studs, girdle, maxspool cam, aft. valvespring,titanium retainers, 06 cr head, studs &orings, monster VP, BFI inj. from DDP,TST on level 1 or 2.Custom twin turbos. so if he was spraying he could be pretty close to the 950-1000hp mark.
 
That's Gus's truck, and he is running a Monster stage II or III pump... They put out some fuel, but streetability is questionable. There was a monster pumped truck at the platte city, mo pull that ran good, but just idling in line sounded nasty (like a terrible miss).

Reliability has not been proven yet with those pumps...
 
My buddy has been through 3 of those luckly so far its been warrenty but how long can this go on? somebody is losing money and for what gain ? I was a die hard VP guy but I wshed I done this long ago I would have alot more money
 
roachie said:
All the fastest cummins power vehicles except schied's have p-pumped 24V's. They are no VP mod trucks. There is a reason.
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Wrong...there are WAY more 12v's out there kicking A$$ than there are 4 valve heads;)

Just remember, $1800 in springs, keepers, retainers, and bridges to make a 4V head live over 3500RPM...and then how long until you break a valve with that small stem...$450 will do the same thing on a 12v;)


Chris
 
4 valve will always flow more. Over 700 on fuel isn't a problem now with the Monster pumps. I will agree that they won't live the life span of the P-pumps but it is what it is. I'll also say that one of my 24v's will be getting a P-pump soon and I'm sure the other won't be long after. I'd say give the Monster a shot and see how you like that.
 
Signature600 said:
Wrong...there are WAY more 12v's out there kicking A$$ than there are 4 valve heads;)

Just remember, $1800 in springs, keepers, retainers, and bridges to make a 4V head live over 3500RPM...and then how long until you break a valve with that small stem...$450 will do the same thing on a 12v;)


Chris
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Every truck/ rail Ive seen in a mag or breaking a record has been a p pumped 24V. I dont rember the names of most of them but they can be found easily.

The problem I have with the 12V vs 24V head is the reasoning. Back in the day pro stocks cars had heads with ports big enough to roll a golf ball down. They found that an oversized port has lazy flow, they went smaller for the velocity.

Cummins didnt make a 24V head for a name. Nor has almost every modern production engine been 4v per cylinder for looks. Granted these are mostly N/A but air is air. I think Piers flow chart had shown the 24V head kickin the 12V azz.

A 24V has smaller valve stems, that can be fixed.Seems a smaller lighter valve doesnt need as much spring but that is way out of my area to make a judgment on. Point taken on the price:doh:


Hammer, I didnt want to sound deffensive but I was refering to overall realiability. As in a p-pump just doesnt decide it dont want to run that day 250mi from home. A vp will be way mor consistent on the dyno.
 
ok, for sure gonna p-pump. have not figured out if im gonna by the kit or piece it together.
 
roachie said:
For my power level a VP could do easy, I killed 4 on the way. But look at a certain 398hp VP truck on here. Thats what I wanted away from.
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You talking bout me? LOL Just kidding.

I'm gonna agree with hammer on this one. While although a p-pump might turn more rpm's or make over 800hp on fuel, how driveable are they at that level for a daily driver? I think for 95% of people, the VP will work just fine. Most people don't want a 4500rpm 800hp monster. They are hot and finicky and smokey with a p-pump. Yes you can put a valet switch in but that only helps so much. If your going for all out performance then yes, the p-pump swap would be great for you. But for most, I think the VP is fine.
 
Signature600 said:
Wrong...there are WAY more 12v's out there kicking A$$ than there are 4 valve heads;)

Just remember, $1800 in springs, keepers, retainers, and bridges to make a 4V head live over 3500RPM...and then how long until you break a valve with that small stem...$450 will do the same thing on a 12v;)


Chris
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Wow i actually agree with you. If you want Power and extreme realiability then the P-pump is the way to go, and there are way more 12v making power than a 24v pumped if your not into racing then you havent seen it but unless all you do is quote magazine page numbers then you shouldnt comment, look at fletchers truck look at maddogs truck, lennys truck scheids trucks all the big numbered guys are 12v yes there are plenty of 24v p-pumped guys making tons of power but dont get it twisted if you think having a 24v head is the best way to go, and if you think that a vp makes more power or you can tune it easier :hehe::hehe: learn how to tune a 12v and make some serious power, not trying to down grade vp's at all cause they are rippin it also. To each his own but SMOKEN02 your making a good choice and you can make some easy power for little money im starting to ramble but good luck with your build and kick some azzz :rockwoot:
 
So if the 12v heads are better than 24v heads will a 12v head bolt right on a 24v engine. Any other difference between the 12v and 24v engines besides the head and pump?
 
smoken02 said:
So if the 12v heads are better than 24v heads will a 12v head bolt right on a 24v engine. Any other difference between the 12v and 24v engines besides the head and pump?
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the pistons are different. the 24v piston has the bowl in the middle of the piston the 12v is off to the side of the piston.
 
smoken02 said:
So if the 12v heads are better than 24v heads will a 12v head bolt right on a 24v engine. Any other difference between the 12v and 24v engines besides the head and pump?
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If you dont have to change your head then there is no reason too, Just buy the kit to convert your 24v to a p-pump and enjoy,
 
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