Ideas to help spool?

MD-LUCKY

MD-LUCKY

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Wanted to see if anyone has some ideas for me here.

I've been running a 35/40 hybrid for several years now. I recently decided to upgrade to a ED 62/68/14. I can't say enough good things about ED, their customer service, and their product. I'll have a whole post about this in a little bit..

I'm just trying to get the spool to light as low as possible, and I wanted to see what other folks say about where their 300 frames light, as well as find out if I'm in need of a few changes..

Here is what happens. If I'm in, say 5th gear, I can bring it down to about 1000 rpm and start to roll into it. At about 1200 to 1300 rpm, the boost needle starts to rise. It will move up to about 10psi by about 1500rpm, then from 1500 to 2000 it feels like an eternity. Black smoke starts to pour, and it is a complete dog. Stays pouring black smoke for several seconds, and then it hits about 1900-2000rpm. Once it hits, I go from around 10psi to about 30 as fast as you can snap your fingers. From 2000 up, the smoke clears, the truck takes off, and everything is amazing.

I thought maybe the wastegate was cracking and bleeding off, so I tightened it down to where it is closed. Same results.

I went through 3-9 on the smarty settings, thinking maybe I was putting the fire out and causing those issues. No real difference. It may spool slightly better with no timing, but it is a difference of about 100-200 rpm at the very most, and it is still extremely smokey and doggy from 1500-2000.

I also played with the torque management, turned it completely on to reduce fuel down low, and it made no difference. Turned it completely off and it made no difference.

Played around with timing settings, from the highest timing to none at all. Really no difference again (maybe spools a few hundred quicker with no timing, but not between 1500-2000).

Played around with the FMS box to try to find a setting that works. Same results. Bringing the fuel on early was still really smokey until the turbo lit around 2000. Leaving the fuel to come on late had the same results.

Does this sound normal? Is this what to expect with a larger turbo and exhaust housing? Once it lights, it's time to hold on.. But, it just feels like the time between 1500-2000rpm takes too long.

Max boost is around 45psi with everything turned on kill, and around 35 without the fueling box on. I was able to hit about 1500* on the pyro, but the egts are generally in check on all settings.

I've been considering a net set of injectors for a while, and trying to figure out if a different set would help with the spool. Right now I'm running a set of jammer 3, and I'm thinking about upgrading to mach 4s.

Does anyone think that a little bigger stick may help increase drive and spool the turbo sooner? Or, does everything sound about right for a turbo this size? I'm considering a 12cm exhaust housing, but I would hate to lose the cooling that I just picked up.. Where is everyone else spooling? Anyone have any ideas to pick up a quicker spool without losing the cooling.. I'm so happy with this turbo that I don't want to make too many changes to the turbo itself, I'm just trying to think of other things to help between 1500 and 1800.
 
I think you just have to learn to drive it, my 62/71 seems to light hard by around 1700 though.... you will learn to keep the revs to a "sweet spot" and it will be a lot more fun! honestly I've driven this charger for so long, I wouldn't go back!

I think the 12cm housing will choke it down and it will spool about the same but have less topend.... but thats just my 2 cents

you need a good quality injector too, it will help tremendously!

But unless I'm just trying to drive hard I; come off from a stop easily and don't start gettin in it until I wind it up some then drive how I want!

Just remember.... compared to a stock charger, your rpm range has just moved up a few hundred rpms, so just rev it a little higher for the same results
 
on edit: my ported exhaust manifold and housing helped tremendously with how the charger drives
 
Hmm.. Thats kind of what I'm thinking.

I did port out the exhaust manifold. I haven't ported the charger at all, but maybe that is another option..

I'm really considering 150hp injectors... Think it will make any difference in the spool?

I can't beleive how this thing hits when it lights. It just flat takes off. From about 1900rpm up, I cant possibly say enough good things. I'm happy the the boost starts to build so soon, but it just doesn't "light" until just before 2000.
 
I think a good quality injector will help tremendously!

to me with a 71mm wheel, it's more on or off with my fueling box on, but with it off i can drive how I want.... I can see an easy 10psi just cruising or on the interstate around 70ish it holds around 10psi.....

Like I said It just takes some getting used to....you've got a manual trans so its really easy for us to drive a bigger charger

Just roll into it until you see 12-15psi and then hit it hard, unless you arent worried about smoke.... it will actually spool sooner if you roll into it too. I noramlly won't mat it until I see about 1700rpms anyways, but then again I am used to driving it and can't really remember what a stock charger drives like.

what rpm do you normally shift at before just normal driving?
 
Thats the other thing.. I'm going from a modified 35/40 hybrid up to this.. So it is a little different. I'm hoping this doesn't come off as me saying negative things about the charger (I'm EXTREMELY happy with the charger) I'm just looking for ideas..

Normally driving around town, I would shift around 2000. Maybe I just need to get used to it.. I'm going to go ahead and look for some injectors. Maybe if my hybrid turbo sells I can afford a decent set!
 
6-speed.

I'm going to get a set of injectors and see what that does. I may just need to get use to the new range with the turbo.. It isn't bad by any means, just "different."

Now to find a set of injectors.. ;)
 
I'm running a 64/71 on a 12 valve and it lights by 1700. Theres no way IMO your charger should be lighting that late.
 
have you checked for boost leaks?

check the compressor outlet, it's really easy to get it a little cocked.... i did this when I first put my s300 on and drove that way for about a year and just thought it was a pig.!
 
I'll double check them all again.

Needle doesn't move or fluttler, so if I have one it can't be very big.. Max boost is around 40-45, which I thought was a little lower for this charger.

I'll play around with the outlet and see if I can get it any better. I think I know someone with a leak tester that I can call..

It's not a pig at all once it lights. In fact, you damn better be holding onto something when it touches off.. It just feels like it's not spooled or lit until around 1900-2000.. It's building boost from 1200 up, just not snappy boost.
 
I had a problem with my exhaust housing being machined to big for the wheel and had that same problem it wouldnt light, semmed like forever, then when it did, hold on. but It wasn't a ED charger either.
 
I'm betting you've got a leak where the discharge elbow clamps to the compressor housing. Seen it countless times with aftermarket turbos from every manufacturer. Some of the Cummins elbows won't seat properly. You can dress it up with a hand file and make it seat.
 
I award you all 10,000,000 internet diagnosis points.


I really thought I had the elbow the compressor housing right... I've probably not done as many as Forest, but I have done a few of these before.. and I've always checked there first.. But noooo, I was convinced, CONVINCED that I did mine right..

I spent about 30 minutes with the compressor loose and getting it all lined up. Really took my time..

And what a freaking difference.

Now I'm building about 20-25 pounds by 1600rpm, and it is completely lit "hold the **** on" by about 1700rpm. I'd say its making around 35-40psi by 1900, and makes a total of around 50psi from 2100 up.

Thanks for the help guys! I'm going to make another post about how this thing reacts.. I think I took enough pictures for a turbo swap write-up for the tech section also.

Thanks again!
 
It's usually something simple! And when you've done something a bunch of times without issue, it's easy to overlook. :D
 
MD-LUCKY said:
I award you all 10,000,000 internet diagnosis points.


I really thought I had the elbow the compressor housing right... I've probably not done as many as Forest, but I have done a few of these before.. and I've always checked there first.. But noooo, I was convinced, CONVINCED that I did mine right..

I spent about 30 minutes with the compressor loose and getting it all lined up. Really took my time..

And what a freaking difference.

Now I'm building about 20-25 pounds by 1600rpm, and it is completely lit "hold the **** on" by about 1700rpm. I'd say its making around 35-40psi by 1900, and makes a total of around 50psi from 2100 up.

Thanks for the help guys! I'm going to make another post about how this thing reacts.. I think I took enough pictures for a turbo swap write-up for the tech section also.

Thanks again!
Click to expand...

LOL! I met Billyram back in 06' when I had my first s300, and was talking about spool to him at an event and he says "let's take a look", OK so we pop the hood and sure nuff it was cocked a little..... totally different truck after that!
 
Faster spool??? Better Bottom end power??

well, first off, take that +.020 Head gasket you have and toss it in the poop can!!

The put the stock Head Gasket back in!!
 
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