oliver 1850

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oliver1850

New member
I have an 1850 oliver with a 354 perkins am in the process of rebuilding it and would like to know if anyone has put a 372 kit in one and turboed it that is what i plan to do and just wanted to know if it would stay cool enough for farm work i dont plan on pulling it just farming
 
sixinarow said:
repower it with a 5.9 then its worth the work,you wont regret it.
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The 372 has a bigger parent bore in the block and the same piss poor piston design. Best way to go is 354 .4 pistons. Rods have to be changed and those pistons are way happier with a turbo. The better .4 bowl makes the same horsepower difference as the 18 cubic inch.
 
very nice. anything major involved mating the trans to the 5.9? I have a 3.9 wiating to go in a mm m670.
 
sixinarow said:
very nice. anything major involved mating the trans to the 5.9? I have a 3.9 wiating to go in a mm m670.
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Nope. Piece of cake on most Olivers and White's. Off the shelf bolt together. Did 2 1655 4bt's. Hate them. Noisy rattly bastards. And they had counterbalanced engines. I won't put a 4b in a tractor if a 6b will fit. M670 would be kind of long with a 6b though.
 
White 120 flywheel and pto hub, if you have the small 16 imput we use a 13" clutch that has the smaller 1650 spline, the 14" pressure plate and a bushing to make the small pilot bearing fit in the pto hub. Got all the stuff here on the shelf.
 
9724VF350 said:
White 120 flywheel and pto hub, if you have the small 16 imput we use a 13" clutch that has the smaller 1650 spline, the 14" pressure plate and a bushing to make the small pilot bearing fit in the pto hub. Got all the stuff here on the shelf.
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What power do you normally run your 6B Olly's at?

Had a customer a few years ago with a 185hp VE pumped 6BT in a 1755....we rebuilt the PTO clutch 4 times, 3 on our dime, before we told him to either turn it down, or stop using the shaft....I'm not sure how the disc mower was holding up, but it would turn those clutches blue in less than 1.5 hours.


Why do you guys not like the Perkins?
Chris
 
Usually 120-160 horse, 185 isn't unusual, assuming you guys checked the pressure. Some guys can break a anvil with a glass hammer though. Most guys can understand not to actually use it as a 160 or 185 horse tractor, but the extra powers is nice to have handy.
Nothing really against the perkins, they should have used a injection pump that wasn't outdated in the 40's though. Putting a Roosa and a Holset on one makes it a completely different tractor. Repowering with a perkins makes a frame swap abolutley necessary. Biggest thing is parts availibity. Usually a guy wants to use a danged combine engine, and all the parts to make it fit a tractor nice is a chore to round up. Dodge truck engine is similar, but the necessary parts to make it fit nice is alot better.

And I'm not a huge fan of supporting Caterpillar.
 
9724VF350 said:
Usually 120-160 horse, 185 isn't unusual, assuming you guys checked the pressure. Some guys can break a anvil with a glass hammer though. Most guys can understand not to actually use it as a 160 or 185 horse tractor, but the extra powers is nice to have handy.
Nothing really against the perkins, they should have used a injection pump that wasn't outdated in the 40's though. Putting a Roosa and a Holset on one makes it a completely different tractor. Repowering with a perkins makes a frame swap abolutley necessary. Biggest thing is parts availibity. Usually a guy wants to use a danged combine engine, and all the parts to make it fit a tractor nice is a chore to round up. Dodge truck engine is similar, but the necessary parts to make it fit nice is alot better.

And I'm not a huge fan of supporting Caterpillar.
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Yeah, of course pressure was fine....we checked it about 70 times to make sure we didn't screw up. We ended up putting drums, pistons, new lines, everything in the PTO system...lost our ass, told him to stop calling. He was a real throttle jockey, and that VE was set to sing about 3450 at full song....told him that wasn't too good for the old tractor either, but he was way smarter than us


I hear you on the Perkins pump, that's honestly the only thing I hate about them, no one understands the CAV pump needs to be bled COMPLETELY before it will run...and they suck to bleed. Also hate supporting CAT nowadays....

Good info though!!
Chris
 
9724VF350 said:
White 120 flywheel and pto hub, if you have the small 16 imput we use a 13" clutch that has the smaller 1650 spline, the 14" pressure plate and a bushing to make the small pilot bearing fit in the pto hub. Got all the stuff here on the shelf.
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Can you PM me with a price, or are you not getting rid of it? The input shaft I have is a 19 spline.
 
Signature600 said:
Yeah, of course pressure was fine....we checked it about 70 times to make sure we didn't screw up. We ended up putting drums, pistons, new lines, everything in the PTO system...lost our ass, told him to stop calling. He was a real throttle jockey, and that VE was set to sing about 3450 at full song....told him that wasn't too good for the old tractor either, but he was way smarter than us


I hear you on the Perkins pump, that's honestly the only thing I hate about them, no one understands the CAV pump needs to be bled COMPLETELY before it will run...and they suck to bleed. Also hate supporting CAT nowadays....

Good info though!!
Chris
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You ever have one of the 12 port perkins heads in your hands? Had one off a burnt MT535 and a burnt newer Massey. Night and day improvement over the old heads. Probably flow twice as much air, probably 150 vs 75 cfm:hehe:.
They'll go right on the .1 blocks, camshaft (valve arrangement), injectors, valvetrain, ect need changed too.
 
torqmonster said:
Can you PM me with a price, or are you not getting rid of it? The input shaft I have is a 19 spline.
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If nothing else, if he has part numbers, I can get you a price on the stuff from AGCO. I could look it up as well, but since he has done it, he would have a better idea on everything needed

9724VF350 said:
You ever have one of the 12 port perkins heads in your hands? Had one off a burnt MT535 and a burnt newer Massey. Night and day improvement over the old heads. Probably flow twice as much air, probably 150 vs 75 cfm:hehe:.
They'll go right on the .1 blocks, camshaft (valve arrangement), injectors, valvetrain, ect need changed too.
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Yeah, rebuilt a couple of them on the newer engines, the head looks similar clear up to the brand new CR engines.

Chris
 
I don't have ten posts yet to reply to a PM, so I'll post it.

We are trying to make it work with the parts we have. Here is what I'm thinking. Using a stock dodge flywheel, getting the center bored out and mating the Oliver PTO HUB, PILOT BEARING, AND BUSHING to that. From what I've seen, I'd have to drill and tap to mount those parts to the stock Oliver 1650 flywheel anyway. Then I can use the stock Oliver clutch disc I have and see if I can also utilize the stock Dodge pressure plate, or adapt the Oliver pressure plate to it. If I can make this work, I think the only parts I would need is the PTO HUB, PILOT BEARING AND BUSHING.

What's your thoughts on that?
 
I've had alot of guys ask about the dodge flywheel thing. The first issue is that it's too thin to work with the oliver pto hub. A dodge flywheel is about 1 1/2" thick, a pto hub is over 2" thick. even trying to use the 16 pto hub, the clutch disc would hit the hub before it hits the flywheel. Not sure where you want to be on horsepower, but a low hp non turbo 5.9 would eat the 16 clutch, they're hard enough on 13" clutches, and I've had guys burn up 14".

Soon as I get a chance I'll take flywheel and pto hub pictures to better explain.
 
After reading that I think I see what you're saying. But if you could post some pics when you get time that would be good too.

So the parts you told me about from the White, would that be that same as finding them from an 1850 with a Perkins?

Also I realize it's going to be hard to keep a clutch in it, but we had in mind to sled pull with it and have the 5.9 tuned up some. What do you suggest for holding the hp? I know it also sucks it looks really tight to try fitting a dual disc clutch in there.
 
the only 1850 part that is the same is the clutch housing that bolts on the front of your 2/3 speed. Flywheel, flywheel housing, pto hub, is all different than what you need.

I've got a 2 disc 13" in my 1655, I used a 2-180 clutch just because I wanted a "quiet" 2 disc. I had to make a thin flywheel, modify the pto hub, machine the clutch housing, do a little work to the pressure plate, use a longer 1550 pto shaft, and use a longer 3 speed imput shaft and then shorten it some. It's 15 pounds of chit in a 5 pound box.

If you don't mind the typical 2 disc rattle, it's a piece of cake to make everything fit.

Looking at your 16 bell housing would make it look tight, the housings normally used in a repower are alot bigger.

Do you have a 2 or 3 speed? Going to more than one disc means you'll have to change the imput to the 1 3/4-27 imput to get longer splines, and you'll have to change it to get a 14" single disc.

If you are pulling a 14" would be minimum. Tractor clutches are a whole different world than truck clutches.
 
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