PLEASE HELP fix my stupidity - starter

ComeandTakeIt

ComeandTakeIt

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Jun 2, 2010
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95
Where do I begin? I swapped my VE pump. Was buttoning everything up and getting ready to turn the motor over and drive. Pulled the air filter off... And this is where the saga really begins.
I realized that due to the hoop I put over the motor I can not fit a 2X6 over the turbo.
IMG_1710_zps74092eb6.jpg

So I scrounged around and behold, the center cap out of a set of Eagle Alloys I have in the garage. I test fit and it worked quite well. To be sure of an air tight fit (I am a one man band) I lined the outer edge with insulation. Test fit again.... AND....:shock: I touched the turbo and positive terminal on the alternator briefly.

What I have:

Starter solenoid mounted on the fender.
IMG_1992_zpsfd5529e5.jpg

Starter with external solenoid (it's a stock starter)

What happened: Sparked off the back of the Alternator
Blew my Maxi fuse
What I have done to remedy:
1. Checked the batteries
2. Checked the pos of battery to starter (good)
3. Replaced the Maxi fuse.. (click)
4. Replaced the external solenoid on the fender (click)
IMG_1993_zps5ec85346.jpg


5. Replaced the starter (thinking I F-ed it, And having checked all i know and could research)...(click)
IMG_1994_zps9da17d7e.jpg


6. I have checked the fuses in the block, all are good. I swapped around relays just for the heck of it.

And just a little rant... That bolt on the backside of the starter...HOLY SHENANDOAH.... I almost threw in the towel. Just crazy how hard it was to get.

I have spent the day out there (hate to admit that) but I am cashing in for the day.

What am I missing???

Boatie :S:[/QUOTE]
 
What's the problem??

Use a 10mm ratcheting wrench to get that back bolt. Make sure it's the offset head and have it angle backwards towards the transmission.
 
oldestof11 said:
What's the problem??

Use a 10mm ratcheting wrench to get that back bolt. Make sure it's the offset head and have it angle backwards towards the transmission.
Click to expand...

Yes sir! A quick trip to Sears and eventually moving the vent tube. Then I just reached i from the front really easily.

To answer your first question: Can't get this starter to turnover either. New solenoid and everything.... I am going to try and jump the starter in the morning.

Boatie
 
You may have back fed voltage to the fusible link that the power for the ignition switch comes from.
 
oldestof11 said:
You may have back fed voltage to the fusible link that the power for the ignition switch comes from.
Click to expand...

Hmmm... Meaning an inline fuse off the ignition switch, but not in the fuse block?? I'm going to be looking for that definitely.
 
The fusible link "pack" is the bundle of happy spaghetti near the hood hinge, just to the driver's side of the grid heater relays.

Inspect them closely for burning and tug at the insulation, if it stretches or breaks, you found the culprit.

Mark.
 
Its right next to the solenoid on that ford, on a wire going onto the solenoid.
 
For some reason I didn't get that this was a Fred you were working on, sorry. :(

Mark.
 
Mark Nixon said:
For some reason I didn't get that this was a Fred you were working on, sorry. :(

Mark.
Click to expand...

No worries Mark. So I tore all the wiring out of the bundles and checked for burning and/or cracking... I didn't find anything. So I put all back together and click. Jumped across the starter... Click and them I jumped across the external solenoid... Click. I'm dumbfounded right now...:nail:
 
Check to see if the motor windings themselves aren't shorted or open.
To do this, make sure the truck is safely secured to where it won't move should the starter actually engage.

Now, there's a wire that is externally accessible on the starter, this is the power to the windings and brushes in the starter.
You need to supply it with power and see what happens.

If all is right, it should just whir when you hit the connection, it SHOULDN'T crank the engine over, though it might "bump" it momentarily if the starter drive is still engaged to the flywheel.

Before you say "it's a new (or rebuilt) starter", I can count on both hands the number of junk "rebuilt" electrical parts I have bought. :(

If you can't readily access a connection to the wire I mentioned above, remove the starter and go have it tested at a parts store like Autozone or O'Reilly's.

Mark.
 
I don't understand why you have the solenoid on the fender, when you've got the one built into the starter itself.

It's redundant, and just unnecessarily complicates things. :pop:
 
Last edited:
BC847 said:
I don't understand why you have the solenoid on the fender, when you've got the one built into the starter itself.

It's redundant, and just unnecessarily complicates things. :pop:
Click to expand...

I would agree. When I re-wired the truck, I just made sure to get it back to what it was as it was working. Since the re wire and a lot of learning along the way, I know that the system is redundant. Was not majorly concerned over fixing it as it worked fine until a day ago. I traced all the wires down this morning and can not find any burned or with loose insulation.
Tried jumping off the starter and then across the solenoid...Click

Could I have froze the Alternator up when I arced off of it. This causing the starter to not be able to turn the motor over???? (this doesn't make any sense in my mind, just a thought) I'm really running out of things to check.

Boatie
 
Mark Nixon said:
Check to see if the motor windings themselves aren't shorted or open.
To do this, make sure the truck is safely secured to where it won't move should the starter actually engage.

Now, there's a wire that is externally accessible on the starter, this is the power to the windings and brushes in the starter.
You need to supply it with power and see what happens.

If all is right, it should just whir when you hit the connection, it SHOULDN'T crank the engine over, though it might "bump" it momentarily if the starter drive is still engaged to the flywheel.

Before you say "it's a new (or rebuilt) starter", I can count on both hands the number of junk "rebuilt" electrical parts I have bought. :(

If you can't readily access a connection to the wire I mentioned above, remove the starter and go have it tested at a parts store like Autozone or O'Reilly's.

Mark.
Click to expand...

Mark,

Will do. That wire on the backside of the starter is a pain to get to...LOL It is in fact a rebuilt starter (Ultima). Damn I do not want to take the starter off again....*bdh* But I need to get this thing running. Of course it's Sunday and it's my DD... and my wife is jokingly giving me a hard time about not having a back up truck....DANG

Boatie
 
BC847 said:
You'll have to jump across them both . . . . at the same time, in order to pass the power to the starter motor. ;)
Click to expand...

Here's a simple workaround.
Just hook the starter solenoid into the main power from the Ford solenoid so that when it is energized, it activates the solenoid on the starter, as well as supplying the main power to the starter.

Or you could take the time and eliminate the damned Fred solenoid. ;)

Mark.
 
You won't necessarily see a burnt wire if its that fusible link, check it for power.
 
Work has me bowed up bad! Better than the alternative though... Will be checking some night this week.

I appreciate all the comments and ideas guys!!!!!!!!

Boatie
 
So a quick update since last, I have checked all fuses. All were good with Voltage. I am having a bit of trouble trying to find what resistance levels I should be reading in Ohms?? So now that I am going to be off "early" today (meaning while it is still light out). I'm going to run through and check all of my grounds.

Will let you know how it goes.

Boatie
 
First... check for voltage at the main lead coming to the starter. Check the ground at the starter motor itself... the ground strap that runs from the motor to the terminal/case. If you are getting power at the main lug and the starter is grounded, and the starter motor does nothing when applying power to the ign. signal terminal on the solenoid that is mounted on the starter... then the starter is junk.

You should have atleast 12.-- volts at the main hot lug on the starter.

Its hard to say what is going on with the added solenoid and what have you... not sure how everything is wired. Does main power come from the battery, to the ford solenoid, then down to the starter?

Either way, if you have 12 volts at the solenoid on the starter and the starter is grounded yet still wont do anything but click when you energize the solenoid that is on the starter, its dead. I'm going to bet that you aren't getting power to the main hot lug on the starter itself since the solenoid is clicking... or the starter motor itself is junk.

Good luck man
-Chris
 
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