Turbo Wheel Lightening

Drothgeb

Drothgeb

Almost Fast-N-Loud
Joined
Sep 18, 2010
Messages
820
I've got my parts together for building a hybrid GT4718/s400. Both the compressor and turbine wheels could use a diet. Looks like I should be able to trim 100+ grams from both of them combined by drilling the backside of the wheels.

I'd be doing this on my mill with a rotary table, so placement would be precise. Then I'd have them balanced independently, then combined.

Whose has done it, and how well did it work?
 
:confused::confused::confused:

I hope you don't plan to spin such a thing very hard.....that metal is there for a reason, man!

The engineers do extensive stress analyses and plan for things like burst (and containment). There is no "extra metal" thrown in there to make it perform worse....
 
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i feel the turbines could be lighter. I think they're like that for production purposes primarily. Inconel can be quite a bit thinner in a number of the places without any adverse affects.

I've wanted to try and lighten a turbine, though i'm chicken.
 
nwpadmax said:
:confused::confused::confused:

I hope you don't plan to spin such a thing very hard.....that metal is there for a reason, man!

The engineers do extensive stress analyses and plan for things like burst (and containment). There is no "extra metal" thrown in there to make it perform worse....
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Well, you are right, the metal is there for a reason. But most of the reason is that it's cheaper to leave it there, then it is to remove it. And for the purposes that it was intended, the performance gain to lighten it, would be minimal. Remember, a big part of an engineers job, is to design something that will work at the lowest cost possible.

I'm just looking to remove some material from the inner portion of the hub where it's well over a inch thick. Can't see where some 3/8" holes in something more than 1" is going to weaken it, as long as it's done precisely and balanced properly. Especially, considering that the blades on the wheels are only 1/16" thick, and that on the outer egde they are traveling at 4-5 times the velocity of the area that I want to do the lightening.

Various engineered parts are lightened all the time by milling, cross-drilling and etc with positive results. Seems like turbo parts are a prime canidate for someone looking to pickup just a touch more spool.
 
Drothgeb said:
Well, you are right, the metal is there for a reason. But most of the reason is that it's cheaper to leave it there, then it is to remove it. And for the purposes that it was intended, the performance gain to lighten it, would be minimal. Remember, a big part of an engineers job, is to design something that will work at the lowest cost possible.

I'm just looking to remove some material from the inner portion of the hub where it's well over a inch thick. Can't see where some 3/8" holes in something more than 1" is going to weaken it, as long as it's done precisely and balanced properly. Especially, considering that the blades on the wheels are only 1/16" thick, and that on the outer egde they are traveling at 4-5 times the velocity of the area that I want to do the lightening.

Various engineered parts are lightened all the time by milling, cross-drilling and etc with positive results. Seems like turbo parts are a prime canidate for someone looking to pickup just a touch more spool.
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I typed a long response, and just decided to delete it...
 
I think I would start asking myself some questions like: "Am I really the first person to think about doing this"? And: "If this was such a good idea, why isn't the market flooded with lightened wheels"?
 
If you haven't machined Inconel before you are in for a treat. Just remember that if the drill squeaks once, don't send it back in the hole.
 
mhuggler said:
I think I would start asking myself some questions like: "Am I really the first person to think about doing this"? And: "If this was such a good idea, why isn't the market flooded with lightened wheels"?
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Actually, that's why I did the posting. Figured I get tons of comments from people that haven't tried, with reasons why it wouldn't work. Just like the crank lightening thread. And, the few that have done it, won't say anything. But decided to try anyway. I'm actually hoping to hear from someone that tried it and failed. Cause I'm curious how and why it failed.

Plus, I don't think that it's worth the trouble on smaller wheels, but with this 88mm coming in at close to 400g for the compressor wheel alone, it might be worth it.

RonA said:
If you haven't machined Inconel before you are in for a treat. Just remember that if the drill squeaks once, don't send it back in the hole.
Click to expand...

Messed with just a little bit of inconel, it does suck!!! But the pucks and wastegate arm I made, were worth the trouble. But, the plan is to start with the aluminum compressor wheel, and go from there. Got a few spares to practice on first.

From other postings I've read, I would suspect that you are someone that might try this. But you didn't comment on whether you think it would work or not. Any input?
 
Drothgeb said:
Actually, that's why I did the posting. Figured I get tons of comments from people that haven't tried, with reasons why it wouldn't work. Just like the crank lightening thread. And, the few that have done it, won't say anything. But decided to try anyway. I'm actually hoping to hear from someone that tried it and failed. Cause I'm curious how and why it failed.
Click to expand...

:clap:
 
Drothgeb said:
Actually, that's why I did the posting. Figured I get tons of comments from people that haven't tried, with reasons why it wouldn't work. Just like the crank lightening thread. And, the few that have done it, won't say anything. But decided to try anyway. I'm actually hoping to hear from someone that tried it and failed. Cause I'm curious how and why it failed.
Click to expand...

Well said man. If your willing to try this and post results, this could be pretty intense.
 
Looking forward to hearing the results. I just wish I had the machines to try similar things myself
 
Sounds expensive if it doesn't work LOL But would be great if it does. All I can say is good luck and im glad im not paying for it :hehe:
 
What about starting with something like an old WH1C or something like that, for a first step in the expirement? Might save you a little on the R&D.

Anyhow Subscribed for results.
 
Torque Monkey said:
What about starting with something like an old WH1C or something like that, for a first step in the expirement? Might save you a little on the R&D.

Anyhow Subscribed for results.
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I'm wondering if hes thinking there will be better gains in the bigger chargers versus using a small charger. But I agree with this idea, like take say an HT3B and try it with?
 
If you show me what, where and how you plan to remove material I may be able run a stress analysis on it for ****s and giggles! I will post results for what dem there computers say it will do...
 
murphy41 said:
I'm wondering if hes thinking there will be better gains in the bigger chargers versus using a small charger. But I agree with this idea, like take say an HT3B and try it with?
Click to expand...

Torque Monkey said:
What about starting with something like an old WH1C or something like that, for a first step in the expirement? Might save you a little on the R&D.

Anyhow Subscribed for results.
Click to expand...

adamsmarshall said:
:umno:

I WILL NOT be drilling into the GTX or the PTE but it would be fun to try with some cheap junk turbos
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Yeah, I do suspect that results will be much more noticeable than with a smaller turbo. And, the 88mm is the current project on my bench.

rdix7991 said:
If you show me what, where and how you plan to remove material I may be able run a stress analysis on it for ****s and giggles! I will post results for what dem there computers say it will do...
Click to expand...

Thanks. I was going to take some measurements and do some sketches first anyway. I'll send you one to analyze.

You know, if you really stop and think about it.....

Wouldn't you think that a genuine Garrett wheel with a few holes in it, would still be stronger than some of the Chinese wheels out there :hehe:
 
Drothgeb said:
Yeah, I do suspect that results will be much more noticeable than with a smaller turbo. And, the 88mm is the current project on my bench.



Thanks. I was going to take some measurements and do some sketches first anyway. I'll send you one to analyze.

You know, if you really stop and think about it.....

Wouldn't you think that a genuine Garrett wheel with a few holes in it, would still be stronger than some of the Chinese wheels out there :hehe:
Click to expand...


Now your just getting cocky. :hehe:
 
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