Whats Stronger The Allison or The 5R110?
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Saber123316
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if I had to pick a ford tranny I would swap in a 4r100.
something with the 5r and torque from a i6 kills it pretty easily.
but IMHO if you got the cummis find a decent 47/48 and set it up less headache.
something with the 5r and torque from a i6 kills it pretty easily.
but IMHO if you got the cummis find a decent 47/48 and set it up less headache.
motoxracer42
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the 5r is amazing. mine amazes me everytime i go down the track. i have been running 12s in the quarter with my lift and big tires and a stock tranny. i love it and its cheap to build. shafts are cheaper and all you really need is clutches cause the direct drive clutches usually go first. i know guys running over 1000hp and all they have are clutches.
motoxracer42
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well there are 3 that i know of.
rush
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That's funny stuff. I'll list the first one. you list the next two with proof please.
1) Shawn Ellerton
2)?
3)?
motoxracer42
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ha lol you guys think this is so funny. i dont know if i am supposed to give out this info lol. you will know soon enough. wouldnt a built 47re be a better setup with a dodge anyway? thats what most guys are switching to on the d maxes.
bags1010
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I would recommend one call to Brian at BTS and let him explain how they all work. I had planned on an Allison and already had the core to be built! But he sure changed my mind about it. I know I do not have a 5r, but Brian has built a 5r for me and has stood behind my 4r in my big truck! Since you have the built 5r already...I say go with it! You would be in the same boat by going to Allison with the clutch sincronization and all. The 5r's are starting to hold up pretty well.
I have about five people interested in the 5R110. I also have a 79 F350 that I'm planning on running a pretty stock Gen 3 in that I could use the 5R in. I really want a five or six speed not a four speed. So I keep leaning towards the Allison or just keeping the 5R and seeing what happens. Scott at Destroked is running some serious power out of his 5.9 with the Allison behind it and hasn't had any problems. I think a lot of the problems people have with the electronic trannys is shift time. Slow shifting time equals clutch slippage and burning burning. From what I hear the Dodge shifts very fast. Maybe I should look at using an Allison 3000. I'm sure they are cheap.
morkable
Just Over Broke
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you will be better off with the 5r than the allison, and I own a allison truck.. the allison is a great tranny if you are running a stock truck and want to pull a trailer,, it has amazing electronics built into designed around towing... but as for strong, it is no, if even as, strong as the 5r,, and the 5r will handle more HP in stock form than any of the other trannies out there.... I wouldnt be worried about running that tranny behind your engine
malibu795
2wd numb nut
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48RE would be simpler on tranny swap.
a MCT1000 weak... sorry..
allison has less clutch surface? prove it..
the electronics on the alli are a double edged sword.. 3-4 shift is were most break stuff. that and when it shifts too fast and binds up..
a MCT1000 weak... sorry..
allison has less clutch surface? prove it..
the electronics on the alli are a double edged sword.. 3-4 shift is were most break stuff. that and when it shifts too fast and binds up..
This is some very informative info I got from dieselmann
TorqShift Transmission:
The 5R110W, or TorqShift, automatic transmission is a redesign of the E40D /4R100. Basically, the gear ratio for first gear was lowered from 2.71 : 1 to 3.09 : 1. To get second gear the overdrive clutch is engaged to give a ratio of 2.2 : 1. Third gear is now the same ratio as the old second gear, 1.54 : 1. The TorqShift is advertised as being a 5 speed automatic, when actually it has six forward speeds. On cold engine operation (below 0 degrees) the overdrive clutch is engaged in third gear for a ratio of 1.09 : 1. The transmission will shift directly to sixth from fourth and fifth is skipped. On a warm engine the shift pattern would be 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th (direct drive), 6th.
Shift performance has been improved through completely redesigning the control valve bodies. The E4OD/4R100 used an electronic pressure control solenoid to adjust apply pressures to the clutches and band depending on load and throttle position. This would give you soft, slipping shifts on light acceleration and harsh shifts on hard acceleration. There was no feedback to the computer for EPC--it was also assumed that the EPC was operating as commanded.
There were two shift solenoids that would divert fluid flow to various shuttle valves to engage the clutches and band for each gear. There were also solenoids to control torque converter clutch and coast clutch operation. The problem with this design was having to time the disengagement and application of each apply component so as to not have too long of a lag between gears, or even worse, two gears applied at one time. There was also limited feedback to the computer as far as whether the components were operating as commanded, other than electrical faults. The computer could see if there was no RPM change at the shift points and set a code, but it could not determine if the problem was hydraulic or mechanical in nature.
On the TorqShift there are pressure control solenoids that directly control each hydraulic apply component with no shuttle valves. There is also pressure sensors to provide feedback so the computer knows whether it needs to increase current to a specifc solenoid to get the necessary hydraulic pressure, making each solenoid its own EPC. Since the computer is directly controlling and monitoring the hydraulic flow and pressure to each component, there are no lags between shifts and each shift is very positive without feeling harsh.
Another new feature on the TorqShift is the Tow/Haul mode. Unlike previous transmission models, this does not deactivate overdrive and immediately turn on the coast clutch. You still have all five active gears. Tow/Haul is a second transmission strategy in the computer. When activated, upshifts will occure at a higher road speed for a given accelerator position for better acceleration. Also, when releasing the accelerator on an upgrade, upshifting is delayed to prevent shift hunting.
The torque converter clutch will lock up at a lower vehicle speed for a given accelerator pedal position to provide improved transmission cooling. It will also stay locked longer on deceleration to provide engine braking. Engine braking is also provided on deceleration through the coast clutch. On the older transmissions EPC would always be minimal with the accelerator in the idle or coast position. This would result in slippage during deceleration on steep down grades, especially with a load. When the Tow/Haul mode is selected on the TorqShift, the computer commands sufficent pressure to the apply components to prevent this slippage.
Finally, to help maintain vehicle speed when desending a grade and help increase brake pad longevity, the transmission will downshift automatically. If the computer senses vehicle speed increase with the accelerator released, it will downshift to the next lowest gear. If vehicle speed continues to increase, the computer will command the transmission to downshift again. The grade braking downshift mode will be deactivated if the Tow/Haul mode is deactivated or the accelerator is depressed.
The TorqShift transmission uses a new fluid--Mercon SP. This is not interchangeable with Mercon (Dextron), Mercon V, or synthetic Mercon. Since there is no torque converter drain, servicing is ment to be done by automatic flush machine. The external filter--mounted on the cooler lines near the radiator--needs to be replaced at the service. Ford has no service interval for the internal pickup filter. I think it is a good idea to replace the internal filter at the service intervals as cheap insurance against a failure. There is a second transmission filter screen that is part of the valve body gasket, but it does not need to be replaced unless the transmission is being repaired. If a flush machine is not available, the trans pan does have a fluid drain. You can either drain and refill the transmision pan, start the engine to circulate the fluid, then drain and refill again. Or, drain and refill the pan, then remove the cooler return line and direct it to a drain pan. Start the engine and as fluid is expelled from the cooler line, add fluid to maintain the level in the pan. It may be more advantagious to have a someone helping you for this method. Replace the external filter after changing the fluid. The external transmission filter is installed on a by-pass, so it only filters 10% of the fluid flow. I would be advantageous to install a secondary filter to capture any contaminates the factory one misses.
Charles David Ledger; dieselmann©2003
TorqShift Transmission:
The 5R110W, or TorqShift, automatic transmission is a redesign of the E40D /4R100. Basically, the gear ratio for first gear was lowered from 2.71 : 1 to 3.09 : 1. To get second gear the overdrive clutch is engaged to give a ratio of 2.2 : 1. Third gear is now the same ratio as the old second gear, 1.54 : 1. The TorqShift is advertised as being a 5 speed automatic, when actually it has six forward speeds. On cold engine operation (below 0 degrees) the overdrive clutch is engaged in third gear for a ratio of 1.09 : 1. The transmission will shift directly to sixth from fourth and fifth is skipped. On a warm engine the shift pattern would be 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th (direct drive), 6th.
Shift performance has been improved through completely redesigning the control valve bodies. The E4OD/4R100 used an electronic pressure control solenoid to adjust apply pressures to the clutches and band depending on load and throttle position. This would give you soft, slipping shifts on light acceleration and harsh shifts on hard acceleration. There was no feedback to the computer for EPC--it was also assumed that the EPC was operating as commanded.
There were two shift solenoids that would divert fluid flow to various shuttle valves to engage the clutches and band for each gear. There were also solenoids to control torque converter clutch and coast clutch operation. The problem with this design was having to time the disengagement and application of each apply component so as to not have too long of a lag between gears, or even worse, two gears applied at one time. There was also limited feedback to the computer as far as whether the components were operating as commanded, other than electrical faults. The computer could see if there was no RPM change at the shift points and set a code, but it could not determine if the problem was hydraulic or mechanical in nature.
On the TorqShift there are pressure control solenoids that directly control each hydraulic apply component with no shuttle valves. There is also pressure sensors to provide feedback so the computer knows whether it needs to increase current to a specifc solenoid to get the necessary hydraulic pressure, making each solenoid its own EPC. Since the computer is directly controlling and monitoring the hydraulic flow and pressure to each component, there are no lags between shifts and each shift is very positive without feeling harsh.
Another new feature on the TorqShift is the Tow/Haul mode. Unlike previous transmission models, this does not deactivate overdrive and immediately turn on the coast clutch. You still have all five active gears. Tow/Haul is a second transmission strategy in the computer. When activated, upshifts will occure at a higher road speed for a given accelerator position for better acceleration. Also, when releasing the accelerator on an upgrade, upshifting is delayed to prevent shift hunting.
The torque converter clutch will lock up at a lower vehicle speed for a given accelerator pedal position to provide improved transmission cooling. It will also stay locked longer on deceleration to provide engine braking. Engine braking is also provided on deceleration through the coast clutch. On the older transmissions EPC would always be minimal with the accelerator in the idle or coast position. This would result in slippage during deceleration on steep down grades, especially with a load. When the Tow/Haul mode is selected on the TorqShift, the computer commands sufficent pressure to the apply components to prevent this slippage.
Finally, to help maintain vehicle speed when desending a grade and help increase brake pad longevity, the transmission will downshift automatically. If the computer senses vehicle speed increase with the accelerator released, it will downshift to the next lowest gear. If vehicle speed continues to increase, the computer will command the transmission to downshift again. The grade braking downshift mode will be deactivated if the Tow/Haul mode is deactivated or the accelerator is depressed.
The TorqShift transmission uses a new fluid--Mercon SP. This is not interchangeable with Mercon (Dextron), Mercon V, or synthetic Mercon. Since there is no torque converter drain, servicing is ment to be done by automatic flush machine. The external filter--mounted on the cooler lines near the radiator--needs to be replaced at the service. Ford has no service interval for the internal pickup filter. I think it is a good idea to replace the internal filter at the service intervals as cheap insurance against a failure. There is a second transmission filter screen that is part of the valve body gasket, but it does not need to be replaced unless the transmission is being repaired. If a flush machine is not available, the trans pan does have a fluid drain. You can either drain and refill the transmision pan, start the engine to circulate the fluid, then drain and refill again. Or, drain and refill the pan, then remove the cooler return line and direct it to a drain pan. Start the engine and as fluid is expelled from the cooler line, add fluid to maintain the level in the pan. It may be more advantagious to have a someone helping you for this method. Replace the external filter after changing the fluid. The external transmission filter is installed on a by-pass, so it only filters 10% of the fluid flow. I would be advantageous to install a secondary filter to capture any contaminates the factory one misses.
Charles David Ledger; dieselmann©2003
New ZF Powerline 6speed Automatic Ford Superduty
Thought this was interesting
First Shift Review: ZF PowerLine Six-Speed Transmission - PickupTrucks.com News
Thought this was interesting
First Shift Review: ZF PowerLine Six-Speed Transmission - PickupTrucks.com News
Torqshift 5R110
The Torqshift 5-speed 5R110 automatic transmission replaced the 4-speed in the 2003 model year truck with 6.0 L diesel engine. The TorqShift design in fact has six forward ratios, but only five are advertised, with the 'hidden' gear only used in extreme cold weather. The TorqShift 1st to 5th gear ratios are 3.11, 2.22, 1.55, 1.00, and 0.71:1. It also utilizes an alternate 4th gear, overdrive on 2nd gear of the 3 speed automatic component (0.72 x 1.55), that is 1.10:1 that is used under cold start conditions to aid engine and transmission warm up. On the TorqShift, once the Tow/Haul mode is activated it can help increase a driver's control when towing large loads up and down steep grades and automatically minimizes shifts and maximizes available torque. Upon descent, the Tow/Haul mode utilizes engine braking to help extend brake life and improve driver control. An adaptive shift function monitors the TorqShift's performance over its lifetime, and adjusts shift pressures in real time to assure consistent shift feel and compensate for wear. For ease of maintenance, the TorqShift's oil filter is a spin-off style, mounted on the passenger-side exterior of the transmission. Also the TorqShift's larger fluid lines and a larger transmission oil cooler help to assure cooler operating temperatures, even under the most demanding conditions.
4R100
Gear 1 2 3 4 R
Ratio 2.71:1 1.54:1 1:1 0.71:1 2.88:1
5R110
Gear 1 2 3 4 5 R
Ratio 3.11:1 2.22:1 1.55 1:1 0.71:1 2.88:1
This is from Wikipedia
The Torqshift 5-speed 5R110 automatic transmission replaced the 4-speed in the 2003 model year truck with 6.0 L diesel engine. The TorqShift design in fact has six forward ratios, but only five are advertised, with the 'hidden' gear only used in extreme cold weather. The TorqShift 1st to 5th gear ratios are 3.11, 2.22, 1.55, 1.00, and 0.71:1. It also utilizes an alternate 4th gear, overdrive on 2nd gear of the 3 speed automatic component (0.72 x 1.55), that is 1.10:1 that is used under cold start conditions to aid engine and transmission warm up. On the TorqShift, once the Tow/Haul mode is activated it can help increase a driver's control when towing large loads up and down steep grades and automatically minimizes shifts and maximizes available torque. Upon descent, the Tow/Haul mode utilizes engine braking to help extend brake life and improve driver control. An adaptive shift function monitors the TorqShift's performance over its lifetime, and adjusts shift pressures in real time to assure consistent shift feel and compensate for wear. For ease of maintenance, the TorqShift's oil filter is a spin-off style, mounted on the passenger-side exterior of the transmission. Also the TorqShift's larger fluid lines and a larger transmission oil cooler help to assure cooler operating temperatures, even under the most demanding conditions.
4R100
Gear 1 2 3 4 R
Ratio 2.71:1 1.54:1 1:1 0.71:1 2.88:1
5R110
Gear 1 2 3 4 5 R
Ratio 3.11:1 2.22:1 1.55 1:1 0.71:1 2.88:1
This is from Wikipedia