2095 plug and 215 pump round 2

NickTF

Single turbo turd.
Joined
Jun 4, 2007
Messages
5,887
I'm having a hard time not getting excited about this and ruling out the weather as a possible culprit (it's been cooler lately usually resulting in a better running truck in my experience) but I swapped in the 2095 plug last night and went for a ride. I did wot before and after that day. With the 2095 plug the truck pulls like an animal past 100mph where it would previously lay flat (4.10 gears and stock head/cam). Felt very very strong spinning tires at lower mph as well. I'm very very excited to hit the track this sunday to see what I get.

Previously I had a t66 from turbonetics and I may have had my timing slipped, both of these items not being able to allow the 2095 plug to shine in my setup. Now with the ED 468 able to burn some fuel and the timing around 26 it's not the case any more.

Just thought i'd share my results. I will report track results this sunday if the weather holds.

I'd say if you don't mind high timing and have some good air put a plug in the 215. Jmho:rockwoot:
 
I ran at lloyd's this summer at his openhouse and we say a gain on the dyno as the go-pedal lifted because it was in the retard notch..BTW 24* timing on that run. also in the video the exhaust goue white midway through the run because of the rearted timing.

600hp_Dyno.JPG



 
I ran at lloyd's this summer at his openhouse and we say a gain on the dyno as the go-pedal lifted because it was in the retard notch..BTW 24* timing on that run. also in the video the exhaust goue white midway through the run because of the rearted timing.

600hp_Dyno.JPG




I had the exact same experience the first time I tried the 2095 plug in this same 215 pump. When I lifted the boost would temporarily increase and the motor would resume it's normal not drowned out sound.

I have since increased timing, changed from a 5x16 injector to a 5x13 injector with much more lift and more pop, went from 191 delivery valves to 022s, and changed from a turbonetics t66 to my current s468. A quick ride during lunch resulting in tire spin like i've never had it before is making me think this 2095 plug is working this time around for me.

What turbo are those dyno results with? You 100% posative you were at 24*?
 
With the 2095 plug the truck pulls like an animal past 100mph where it would previously lay flat (4.10 gears and stock head/cam).

I have tons of top end charge with the 2095 in my pump, and I know of a guy a little ways north of me that picked up around 80-90hp by putting the 2095 in his 215 pump. On paper it shouldn't work, but for some reason it seems to help.

Hopefully both of us will finally get to post 11 second passes on Sunday. My looser converter really helped out, and if I get a cam in time I should have it in before I head to the track. :Cheer:
 
I have tons of top end charge with the 2095 in my pump, and I know of a guy a little ways north of me that picked up around 80-90hp by putting the 2095 in his 215 pump. On paper it shouldn't work, but for some reason it seems to help.

Hopefully both of us will finally get to post 11 second passes on Sunday. My looser converter really helped out, and if I get a cam in time I should have it in before I head to the track. :Cheer:

Awseome Brett! I think it's really charger dependant to be honest with you. You need the air to be able to burn the fuel! As i've said in the past I had similar results to Mo Smoke the first go I had at it.

I've been going back and forth with Seth about it and he had some interesting views on the whole retard thing, i.e. that in fact the timing may not really be retarding at all at higher rack but mid rack instead. Hopefully he will chime in on it as his understanding is far greater!

I can't wait to hit the track that's for sure!
 
Brett, can that timing pulse trigger be left on the line and plot timing in relation to rack position on a dyno run somehow?
 
Brett, can that timing pulse trigger be left on the line and plot timing in relation to rack position on a dyno run somehow?
The only way for me to do that would be finding someone with big balls (or dumb enough) to hold the timing light and watch the mark on my balancer while I make a run.
 
I've been going back and forth with Seth about it and he had some interesting views on the whole retard thing, i.e. that in fact the timing may not really be retarding at all at higher rack but mid rack instead. Hopefully he will chime in on it as his understanding is far greater!

I'm curious to hear more. I've never been able to get my hands on anything that really explains the workings of a p-pump, so everything for me has been trial and error. I can never explain why it works other than it does or doesn't.
 
I'm curious to hear more. I've never been able to get my hands on anything that really explains the workings of a p-pump, so everything for me has been trial and error. I can never explain why it works other than it does or doesn't.

I hear ya, i've been fortunate thanks to this board to meet some people that really know their p-pumps and I must say it really pisses me off when those who are willing to share are ridiculed for it (hinting at another thread). Trying it for yourself will prove or disprove it everytime if adequate testing is given to what you're trying. We'll see sunday *prays for good weather*:rockwoot:. For those that don't have a dyno or hundres or thousands to spend on testing, changing, etc. those people willing to share become an incredibly valuable asset!!!!!!
 
I just looked at my dyno sheet and it also starts to ramp back up a little bit a 3125rpm or 112mph.
BrettDyno-1.jpg
 
I just looked at my dyno sheet and it also starts to ramp back up a little bit a 3125rpm or 112mph.
BrettDyno-1.jpg

Did you lift abruptly or very slowly? Mo Smoke had a sharp peak as he lifted. His sharp peak was more consistant with what I'd expect given my first encounter with the plug.

Brett, yours is much more gradual. Further, you have a plate limiting full rack so i'm not sure how the plug could benefit you unless portions of your plate that are similar to a zero plate are being touched by the governor arm. During my first bad experience with the 2095 plug I tried to put a zero on just shy of full forward to keep the rack from hitting the 2095 plug and not having to change it out (yea lazy I know). It didn't work for me, even with the zero just shy of full forward I was still hitting the 2095 plug.
 
Anyone know what the notch in a 215 plunger looks like? Is it a straight cut parallel with top of the plunger? Or slanted in some direction? I know Weston touched on this topic once but I do not recall the exact figures.

I would be really interested to see how a 215 pump flows at various amounts of rack travel on a bench. That information coupled with some incite from spill-port timing could really shed some light on the mystery behind the notch.

If I knew anyone who had access to a flow bench I would be curious to see how these data sheet filled out. I’d even be willing to throw some money their way if they could help. I think a rack plug with an adjustable set screw machined in would make a very handy tool.
Ahh, the knowledge that could be gained at a pump shop….

travelvsoutput.jpg
travelvsduration.jpg
:bang
 
Hard to say for certain what's going on. Alls we have is our ideas and explanations that may make sense in our heads but not in others nor actually be reality:bang$.02

:bow: Agreed. Since no one has been able to isolate the effects of the plug specifically the best we have is assumptions.

I'm curious to hear more. I've never been able to get my hands on anything that really explains the workings of a p-pump, so everything for me has been trial and error. I can never explain why it works other than it does or doesn't.

The fact that it works is all that matters though! Its great that you have been able to do so much trial and error. Thanks for the help Brett :thankyou2: Keep it coming!
 
Anyone know what the notch in a 215 plunger looks like? Is it a straight cut parallel with top of the plunger? Or slanted in some direction? I know Weston touched on this topic once but I do not recall the exact figures.

It's not a notch on the 215 plunger...we call it an upper helix. If viewed from the side it looks like a U-Shape, in which the high parts of the helix are at idle (next to shut-off) and at full rack...

I had never looked critically at all the 215 plunger timing issues until I got a hold of a Sigma here recently...just fyi, Sigmas have an upper helix too, one that advances timing with increased rack travel.

I'm half scared to express my findings, because I already know what the end result will be.

For those of you curious about what I'm not saying, look on this site at any pump timing chart. What is a recurring theme about timing vs. lift?
 
It's not a notch on the 215 plunger...we call it an upper helix. If viewed from the side it looks like a U-Shape, in which the high parts of the helix are at idle (next to shut-off) and at full rack...

I had never looked critically at all the 215 plunger timing issues until I got a hold of a Sigma here recently...just fyi, Sigmas have an upper helix too, one that advances timing with increased rack travel.

I'm half scared to express my findings, because I already know what the end result will be.

For those of you curious about what I'm not saying, look on this site at any pump timing chart. What is a recurring theme about timing vs. lift?

I'll play, I'll play lol. Simply that the lift value needed increases with timing (i.e. the higher timing you want the higher plunger lift that is necessary at tdc).
 
I'll play, I'll play lol. Simply that the lift value needed increases with timing (i.e. the higher timing you want the higher plunger lift that is necessary at tdc).

Bingo...

SO...if a person were to esssentially raise the plunger 1.6 mm further, without rotating the pump, what would the result be in timing change (degrees) (assume on a 215 pump cam for calculating) and which direction would the timing change?
 
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