Anyone work with extreme studs .com?

crazyrunner33 said:
I noticed this today also, I've got two studs higher than the others. Did you just remove material off the part of the stud that is not threaded?
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Yeah, I cut off just enough to clear. It comes out looking more or less like the top. I painted it with hi-temp paint too.
 
straight 6 roar said:
I looked in the materials engineering database at school and found some values. I need more info than the basics of what each site says but:

Custom Age 625 Cold Drawn Plus Aging: 269,000 psi. Looks right on track with ARP site.

AISI Type H13 Hot Work Tool Steel: 289,000 psi.

H13 looks extremely strong, 7% stronger than 625. My personal opinion I wouldn't hesitate to use it...the block threads are probably more likely to deform than the stud. Site says black oxide finish for corrosion resistance.
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Couple things here. You are looking at max psi, not the yeild. The materials are actually not that much different on yeild strenght for material. The key note to these is Max psi for 625 is 269Kpsi but yield is only at 261k psi. The H13 material has a higher psi of 289Kpsi but lower yeild of 231Kpsi. The hardnest factor with elasticity is a good thing though. Your getting less yeild from the H13 which, I assume, is why retorque is something that may not be needed for these at normal intervals. Now, the application of these usually does not get to the max operating of these specs. In looking at the the yeild over the working specs they much better for H13 as 9% yeild is only gained over the last 50Kpsi while that 12% yeild for 625 is over a much smaller area (7Kpsi). Essentially it wont stretch as far as 625 over a greater area. Again hand to the H13. I am going to talk to my engineers as I don't normally deal with these materials on a daily basis but I do deal with things like this everyday and unless I am missing something (and since my main studs are already these) I will be ordering them shortly.
 
For future reference I would recommend using a drill on the two stud holes where the alignment dowels are instead of cutting down the stud. In Scheid's instructions for the studs they use they say to cut the dowels out to 9/16". The shoulders on these 12mm studs are wide like previously mentioned, probably wider than the ARP 625 studs.
 
crazyrunner33 said:
For future reference I would recommend using a drill on the two stud holes where the alignment dowels are instead of cutting down the stud. In Scheid's instructions for the studs they use they say to cut the dowels out to 9/16". The shoulders on these 12mm studs are wide like previously mentioned, probably wider than the ARP 625 studs.
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Yeah, I would have done that, if I had of noticed before I started to torque them. Now that I have the head off again, I'll probably go ahead and replace them.

I had high hopes for these studs, but considering I didn't make one full run before the head gasket blew, I'm not so sure now. Just pulled the head over the weekend, the rings were well seated, all nuts were @ 140lbs, I was set for under 80psi of boost too. Still pretty bummed that I couldn't get in at least a few runs.

This time I'm trying it with the .010 gasket, so I'll see what happens. Maybe I should have gone 14mm?
 
I have the feeling that the head gasket would have still blown even with 14mm studs, do you have a coolant bypass or some modification to the pump to keep the coolant pressure down at higher RPM? How many retorques did you do?

On mine I ended up stripping the block threads before realizing the stud didn't go all the way down. I ended up getting a 14mm stud from another vendor since they were able to get the stud one day earlier than a 14mm replacement from Jeff. On the 14mm from a different vendor the stud is actually thinner than the 12mm studs from Jeff. I performed my first retorque yesterday and less than half of the studs from Jeff moved, the 14mm ended up moving a quarter turn.

I talked to Jeff about the issue about the issue with the two studs not going all the way down in the dowels, he apologized for the issue and told me there are two studs turned down a little in the kit, he mentioned that he'll be adding them to the instructions. For people who plan on installing these you just need to be careful and look for the two studs that need to be turned down, one needs to go in the front passenger corner(#26) and the other one is on the same row a few holes down, can't remember which one.
 
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crazyrunner33 said:
I have the feeling that the head gasket would have still blown even with 14mm studs, do you have a coolant bypass or some modification to the pump to keep the coolant pressure down at higher RPM? How many retorques did you do?

On mine I ended up stripping the block threads before realizing the stud didn't go all the way down. I ended up getting a 14mm stud from another vendor since they were able to get the stud one day earlier than a 14mm replacement from Jeff. On the 14mm from a different vendor the stud is actually thinner than the 12mm studs from Jeff. I performed my first retorque yesterday and less than half of the studs from Jeff moved, the 14mm ended up moving a quarter turn.

I talked to Jeff about the issue about the issue with the two studs not going all the way down in the dowels, he apologized for the issue and told me there are two studs turned down a little in the kit, he mentioned that he'll be adding them to the instructions. For people who plan on installing these you just need to be careful and look for the two studs that need to be turned down, one needs to go in the front passenger corner(#26) and the other one is on the same row a few holes down, can't remember which one.
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Well, since I couldn't believe that it blew, I've spent a lot of time checking things out, and was able to figure out what happen. But it took putting the gasket under a microscope (real microscope) for me to figure it out.

My head has double O-rings. One is in the center of the combustion ring, and the outer is positioned so that it hits the outer edge of the combustion ring and turns it down. That worked perfectly on 5 3/4 of the cylinders. But on the OEM Cummins gasket that I used, the #1 combustion ring was ever so slightly shifted to the side, and the O-ring hit on top of it for a couple of inches instead of just turning it down. That was enough to hold the head up and and prevent a perfect seal there. Under the microscope, I can see where it blew out on either side where the O-ring transitioned from riding on the combustion ring, to where it just turned it down. I have a couple of new gaskets to compare to the old one, and can see that the old one lines up to the new ones on all cylinders except for #1. The difference was only .010, but that was enough. I was going to use a .010 over gasket, but now that I figured it out I'm going with stock thickness. This time I'm moving to alignment pins to the head to check the fit first.

I did 4 cold re-torques and 2 after cool down and, I checked torque on them before I pulled it apart and all of them were tight, so that was not a factor. Going to 14mm probably wouldn't have helped either, but they may have been enough to compress it at the overlap, hard to tell.

I've been calling Jeff all week about the alignment pin issue, but have not been able to reach him. I just cleaned them last night and they are sitting on the bench ready to go back in. So when I get home in a few hours the first thing that I'm going to do is look for the 2 that were turned down for the pins. Maybe I missed that??? Either way, I'll be giving him a another call when I have them in hand.
 
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Turns out that my set didn't have the turned down studs. But I got a hold of Jeff, and even though we both agreed that turning them down had nothing to do with the gasket blowing, he's going to send me a couple of new full diameter ones, and I'm going to turn the two pins. He gets a thumbs up for good customer service :rockwoot:
 
Drothgeb said:
Turns out that my set didn't have the turned down studs. But I got a hold of Jeff, and even though we both agreed that turning them down had nothing to do with the gasket blowing, he's going to send me a couple of new full diameter ones, and I'm going to turn the two pins. He gets a thumbs up for good customer service :rockwoot:
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Glad you figured out the problem and had good luck with Jeff. I think turning the dowels down should be the way to go, it can even be done with the head on if performed carefully.
 
Well, it's back together. Did 3 cold re-torques, then ran it for a few days and did another. After talking to Jeff, I went to 150lbs this time. Actually went over it several times over a few hours span last night. Tonight I'm back at the track, so it'll get put to the test. That new performance rebuild including steel 360 bearing in the turbo is going to get tested too. I'd like to wait a little longer, but it's already Labor Day.
 
I can't wait to see how the studs work out. I am looking into getting a set when the time comes.
 
Let us know how everything works out.I'm stoked there's a solid alternative to ARP,I think they really stick it to us diesel guys on pricing. Do they do 24v mains? Valve springs,hardware and pistons are so freeking expensive in the diesel world.I understand turbos being up there but the rest is just milking us dry. Reminds me of a certain wildly over priced set of 12v valve springs.....
 
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Ive got a new set of A1 rod bolts, never used. 24v.
I bought a set of carrillo rods, and wont be using them.
$125 shipped.
 
NicG said:
Let us know how everything works out.I'm stoked there's a solid alternative to ARP,I think they really stick it to us diesel guys on pricing. Do they do 24v mains? Valve springs,hardware and pistons are so freeking expensive in the diesel world.I understand turbos being up there but the rest is just milking us dry. Reminds me of a certain wildly over priced set of 12v valve springs.....
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Well, I made it through the night, and I don't have to look at at pistons this weekend!!! :woohoo:

But, I was trying to dial in at the 11.9 index, so launches were only 10-15 psi, max boost was mid 60s, and I left it in drive, so it didn't see much over 3000rpm either. Now, I'll drive it for a couple of weeks, re-torque, and push it hard next time.

Personally, I think that the Extreme studs are a good jump over the regular ARPs. They're actually 13mm, just turned down for 12mm threads in the block, 240ksi, and can handle 150lbs of torque. Good customer service too!

I know what you mean about valve springs too. I don't mind paying good money for good parts, but it pisses me off when they try to gouge you.
 
What's the price on the rod bolts? The buy thingy is over the numbers on mine for some reason.
 
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