looking for a 24v p-pump runner intake

getblown5.9 said:
Who makes a bolt on style open plenum intake thats shaped similar to stock. Basically I want a stock looking intake that can be bolted back on after the head is ported and still uses an air horn to dump air into it.
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My 24v P Pump manifold is a top entrance that is the same dimensions as the stock air horn so you could use your grid heater on it if you want. I also cut a second hole further back so you can have a dual air horn setup.
 
I'm going to sound stupid here (like usual). But I thought the point of cutting off the plenum was so you can port the intake side of the head? Seems all of these threads about aftermarket intakes with runners or plenums are solely based around the intake and no benefit to the head..

After reading this, I'm pretty sure the plenum style will be best for my application. Although I want it to enter from the side, behind the pump. Instead of coming in from the top. Still haven't seen one that I have been all that thrilled about. Might have to have one made by a local machinist instead.
 
Lucky Jeff said:
I'm going to sound stupid here (like usual). But I thought the point of cutting off the plenum was so you can port the intake side of the head? Seems all of these threads about aftermarket intakes with runners or plenums are solely based around the intake and no benefit to the head..

After reading this, I'm pretty sure the plenum style will be best for my application. Although I want it to enter from the side, behind the pump. Instead of coming in from the top. Still haven't seen one that I have been all that thrilled about. Might have to have one made by a local machinist instead.
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The porting of the intake side of the head is assumed/understood. We are concerned with having a large enough volume of pressurized air available during high demand - hence large plenums and IR intakes.

Regarding a side entrance - the pump blocks a good portion of that side of the head which is likely why no one has a side entrance for a p-pumped truck. You would be "starving" the front cylinders.
 
j-rod said:
The porting of the intake side of the head is assumed/understood. We are concerned with having a large enough volume of pressurized air available during high demand - hence large plenums and IR intakes.

Regarding a side entrance - the pump blocks a good portion of that side of the head which is likely why no one has a side entrance for a p-pumped truck. You would be "starving" the front cylinders.
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Yea I've just heard by too many people that the porting the intake side wasn't very beneficial..

Can't you still get a straight shot between 3 and 4 (or close to it) behind the pump? It's been a while since I've seen the pump bolted to my motor :bang..
 
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Lucky Jeff said:
Yea I've just heard by too many people that the porting the intake side wasn't very beneficial..

Can't you still get a straight shot between 3 and 4 (or close to it) behind the pump? It's been a while since I've seen the pump bolted to my motor :bang..
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In what application? Cummins heads can't flow a lot compared to other heads out there, but there is still much of an improvement that can be made with a good ported head.

If you are thinking of running something like Toolman's intake on a p-pump truck, you still have the issue of clearance alongside the pump (not a lot of room for a rectangular-shaped plenum) as well as the length of the pump to contend with on the inlet. Not sure on exact location on end of pump, but I'm thinking its somewhere around beginning to middle of 4?
 
j-rod said:
In what application? Cummins heads can't flow a lot compared to other heads out there, but there is still much of an improvement that can be made with a good ported head.

If you are thinking of running something like Toolman's intake on a p-pump truck, you still have the issue of clearance alongside the pump (not a lot of room for a rectangular-shaped plenum) as well as the length of the pump to contend with on the inlet. Not sure on exact location on end of pump, but I'm thinking its somewhere around beginning to middle of 4?
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I'm not all that fond of the big, blocky intake plenum... Sadly I'd prefer something more like what *gulp* Banks has.
 
Toolman said:
My 24v P Pump manifold is a top entrance that is the same dimensions as the stock air horn so you could use your grid heater on it if you want. I also cut a second hole further back so you can have a dual air horn setup.
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pics and price?
 
mmmmm - if you study air flow, you will find the same as the automotive engineers did - longer runners, whether charged or naturally aspirated, makes more torque across the board as compared to a log or plenum style manifold on its own
You will also find that runner shape makes a difference because air is a fluid and hates corners as well as perfectly round, so an odd oval seems to work best - but again - you will have to research for yourself, as this tiny page isnt near big enough for 1000's of pages of engineering data to support my statements

Runner length can be tuned to move the power band around slightly as well

you will also find that there is a calculation for plenum sizing which usually works out to the equivalent of two cylinders volume

being under pressure does alleviate some of this - but if you seek the maximum every last drop of power kinda thing , then do the calcs, and build accordingly

There have been a couple really close versions presented on a few threads on this forum

If a heater grid wasnt necesary, one could easily make a "calculated" plenum/runner intake that might present more than a few more hp than we normally see from a fabricated intake, and yes me thinks the plenum might look a lot like the Big Boss, Banks makes, only with runners
 
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seeker1056 said:
mmmmm - if you study air flow, you will find the same as the automotive engineers did - longer runners, whether charged or naturally aspirated, makes more torque across the board as compared to a log or plenum style manifold on its own
You will also find that runner shape makes a difference because air is a fluid and hates corners as well as perfectly round, so an odd oval seems to work best - but again - you will have to research for yourself, as this tiny page isnt near big enough for 1000's of pages of engineering data to support my statements

Runner length can be tuned to move the power band around slightly as well

you will also find that there is a calculation for plenum sizing which usually works out to the equivalent of two cylinders volume

being under pressure does alleviate some of this - but if you seek the maximum every last drop of power kinda thing , then do the calcs, and build accordingly

There have been a couple really close versions presented on a few threads on this forum

If a heater grid wasnt necesary, one could easily make a "calculated" plenum/runner intake that might present more than a few more hp than we normally see from a fabricated intake, and yes me thinks the plenum might look a lot like the Big Boss, Banks makes, only with runners
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I would like to know how an oval-shaped runner will flow better than a circular runner.
 
J-rod - like i said you will have to research - how do i describe fluid eddies, going around a tight round corner, that doesnt happen as much with an oval shape
 
seeker1056 said:
J-rod - like i said you will have to research - how do i describe fluid eddies, going around a tight round corner, that doesnt happen as much with an oval shape
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I don't need to research. I disagree with your statement. I don't know the specifics of what you are thinking of, but strictly for flow, a circular tube will outflow any other cross-section due to less head loss.
 
Jrod - dont confuse a straight tube with the cross sectional variances and twists and turns of a port, wether intake or exhaust

you will also note my statement was qualified by the air having to make a tight turn not a straight run

if your statement were true the various engineers of the performance motor world would not have spent millions/billions over the years investigating port flow and inventing the oval intake port nor the D shaped exhaust port - both of which are categorically known to outflow any other shaped port known to man
 
seeker1056 said:
You will also find that runner shape makes a difference because air is a fluid and hates corners as well as perfectly round, so an odd oval seems to work best
Click to expand...

seeker1056 said:
Jrod - dont confuse a straight tube with the cross sectional variances and twists and turns of a port, wether intake or exhaust

you will also note my statement was qualified by the air having to make a tight turn not a straight run

if your statement were true the various engineers of the performance motor world would not have spent millions/billions over the years investigating port flow and inventing the oval intake port nor the D shaped exhaust port - both of which are categorically known to outflow any other shaped port known to man
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Where is your qualification? Did you edit it out? All your statement says is that air is a fluid that "hates corners as well as perfectly round". If your comments are targeted toward head port design, fine. Your previous statements are not prefaced well if that is the case.

That being said, are you trying to say that IR intakes should use oval runners instead of round or rectangular? I do not see how "cross sectional variances and twists and turns" are applicable in this instance.
 
So does anyone have any pics of what kind of machining they do to the head to get all ports completely seperate from eachother? Or is that still super secret don't even tell your Mom kinda stuff?
 
I dont think anyone has done it yet. It really dont look cost effective. I think most are just feeding them like the one scheid builds.
 
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