Opinions on D-Max performance please

CTDYoungGun

CTDYoungGun

Seth- Fuel Injection Guy
Joined
Aug 7, 2007
Messages
1,568
Ok guys and gals...i'm 100% sure i'm beating a dead horse here...but here we go...I am and always have been a cummins guy, but i've decided to buy a duramax and plan to have one within the next month or so...final plan for the truck are (for now) to have a B.A. street driveable truck that can also hold it's own on a track or sled pull...but nothing fully-built...

All the d-max guys around are telling me that I will be ok to run EFI live with a hot tune and be able to have somewhere around 500 hp on a switch as long as i build up a tranny and have an aftermarket intake and exhaust...

my questions are, is this right? how much will a "stock" d-max handle before massive breakage? I am partial to ATS tranny's and can get them reasonable snce i work at a diesel shop, so what stage should i build for a durable tranny for playing on the streets and an occasional sled-pull or drag-race?

And finally, what mods should i look at other than the gimme's...exhaust, intake, gauges...etc...should aftermarket fuel supply and turbo changes be in my plans?
 
From what I have observed... for 500HP

Stock turbo will make a good streetable 500HP but not much more reliably

A stage 4 ATS is the right choice

A FASS is needed (or other brand)

I've ridden in TTS tuned Dmax's and EFI tuned Dmax's and if it were mine I'd most deffinitely have a TTS... smoother power compared *to my experience* with EFI


Lavon
 
What gen Dmax? LB7, LLY, LBZ, or LMM?

All gens are capable of 500RWHP with a "Stock" engine, turbo and CP3.

TTS (LB7 only) , Ridgerunner, Mcrat, PPE all have tunes that will get you there or real close. You will need a built trans Suncoast or ATS. I reccomend a lift pump of some sort and a 4" exhaust.


I reccommend EFI Live. Why? There is no magic tune that will be 500+ on every truck. What one truck likes another may not. So being able to tune your truck as needed is the way to go. The only way one can to do that is why EFI Live.

Funny thing about those that run canned tunes is most still have EFI Live to log and compare data..

Just my$.02
 
JOHNBOY said:
What gen Dmax? LB7, LLY, LBZ, or LMM?

All gens are capable of 500RWHP with a "Stock" engine, turbo and CP3.

TTS (LB7 only) , Ridgerunner, Mcrat, PPE all have tunes that will get you there or real close. You will need a built trans Suncoast or ATS. I reccomend a lift pump of some sort and a 4" exhaust.


I reccommend EFI Live. Why? There is no magic tune that will be 500+ on every truck. What one truck likes another may not. So being able to tune your truck as needed is the way to go. The only way one can to do that is why EFI Live.

Funny thing about those that run canned tunes is most still have EFI Live to log and compare data..

Just my$.02
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to answer your question i am planning on getting a lb7...because that is my price range...

also, let's say i get my d-max and do the following mods: 5" exhaust, performance intake, efi live, built tranny, and performance fuel supply (fass) would i have problems with it running hot or consistanly tearing things up?

My driving style is pretty mellow for a 20 year old...just the occasional urge to smoke a ricer or another diesel truck...think i would have problems if i was halfway logical about my right foot and the efi live tune?

as far as tunes, i have a connection that has the commercial version and a bunch of pulling and racing tunes already, so that isn't a problem...
 
I'd suggest a kennedy or PPE lift pump, I have heard about problems with FASS. {lus, they are both $700 cheaper.
 
I am running basically what you are asking for. Hot program , built tranny, pump,stock turbo,stock injectors and 4" exhaust..but don't forget the weak front ends under these trucks. Go ahead and make plans to replace and strengthen the front end.

My truck is what I call reliable/streetable..If I have to haul or drive any distance I just put a smaller tune in it, for the fact that the bigger tunes are not very interstate drivable to me. You can do it...but My truck surges.

Also I don't think there is a need for a 5" exhaust..Just my $.02
 
wideopen said:
I am running basically what you are asking for. Hot program , built tranny, pump,stock turbo,stock injectors and 4" exhaust..but don't forget the weak front ends under these trucks. Go ahead and make plans to replace and strengthen the front end.

My truck is what I call reliable/streetable..If I have to haul or drive any distance I just put a smaller tune in it, for the fact that the bigger tunes are not very interstate drivable to me. You can do it...but My truck surges.

Also I don't think there is a need for a 5" exhaust..Just my $.02
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wideopen: i know i've already asked this, but how do egt's with efi live tuned hot compare to a hot chip or other programmer? Also, as for the front-ends...i've seen tie rods break when guys are sled-pulling, but what else has to be beefed up in the front-end?

I'm also planning on getting the dsp5 switch...just to save me having to re-tune the truck anytime i have to really work it...and as for the 5", i know there's no point, but i can get it for the same price as 4" and i like the sound ;)

also, thanks b lot to those who have already given me input...i know i need it...lol
 
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You ought to be good with just tie rod sleeves and lowering the torsion bars when you go to the track. A centerlink also might not be a bad idea if you plan on pulling much.
 
Phil made his centerlink into a pretzel, launching it. SuperDiesel has a combo pack sleeves and centerlink.

I layed down 412HP and 811 TQ on Sept 8th. You can see below what I have.
 
but how do egt's with efi live tuned hot compare to a hot chip or other programmer
Click to expand...

It really depends on the tune you're runnin' with EFIlive, you could build lotta tunes that would get real hot in a hurry, but most aren't that bad. The cool thing about EFIlive is that if a tune is getting too hot for you, you can fix it without much headache. There definitely is a learning curve with this software, though. It's not like a Superchips programmer or something where you just go plug it in and haul ass. It's REALLY in depth. It's an awesome program, though.
 
Here's the deal on the EGT's. In my opinion, they aren't going to be crazy unless you are doing crazy things like WOT runs or sled pulling, etc. Any other time, like regular driving or hauling with a sensible tune, they are gonna be fine. The times they get high are the times you expect them to and its typically for short bursts so there is little to worry about.

I drive my approx. 500rwhp Dmax daily. It is stock charger, stock engine, etc. I have a stage III SC from Eric Merchant. I have Team Salad tuning (group of folks helping each other optimize tunes via McRat Racing) on a DSP5 switch. Other than that and the 5" exhaust and cheap ass air intake (looks much cooler than it actually probably helps) its stock, performance wise. I drive approx. 25-30k miles a year in my truck. I do a fair amount of smoke blowing and street racing. Point is, my truck makes pretty good power and I'm not affraid to drive it anywhere at any point.

IMO the Dmax is hard to beat for that type of application - hotrod/Daily Driver and I really don't think you'd be dissappointed.


C-ya
 
thanks a lot guys...i was really riding the fence on the durability of these d-max's...i realize that most of the problems will be self-inflicted, but i didn't want to plan on building a ticking time bomb and then have to pay again to fix it...

hopefully in a couple months i'll have a new avatar of my d-max...thanks again to all you folks
 
More Info

The only durability issue I have seen with the DuraMax in 8 models years is the Injectors of the 1st Gen LB7's (2001-early 2004). They will at some point need to be replaced. Otherwise it is a great package. I had two trucks in the shop the other day. One had 6667 hours and 242,000 miles the other had 6612 hours and 101,000 miles. Both got injectors. Note the difference is usage of the trucks. One is a farm vehicle the other is combination driven. A lot of people don't pay attention to the hour meter. I think it is important. On the 01's and 02's you have to hold the trip reset button in while the key is off for the hour meter to come up.

There is a GM Special Policy on the injectors for 7 years or 200,000 miles on the 01-03's.

My 2003 has 3500 hours and is still on the orginal injectors. It is daily driven and used for farm work also. It has approx. 500 RWHP on the stock turbo, stock injectors, and stock injection pump.

By the way, supposedly there are some new injectors in development for these trucks.
 
my truck w/ all the mods in my signature has been great. really fun to drive and sled pull, it's also about ready to turn 144k.
 
CTDYoungGun, if your looking to build a 500hp daily driver that does the occasional sled pull or race then you will be better off and much happier going with a plug-n-play tuner such as any of those previously stated. EFI Live gives you access to the tables of the tune and will get very complicated and overwelming very quick. It's best suited for racers and experienced tuners. If you have no experience tuning a diesel engine or understand every single component, sensor, and device on the truck then trying to use EFI Live will get you in trouble in a hurry. For what your wanting to do a plug-n-play programmer or box will be the better choice. BTW- you wont come anywhere near 500hp on a stock tranny. That needs to be the first thing you do. If you add a tuner before the tranny build, then dont go over 425hp. If you feel like you will become a hard core racer or puller and want to go over 500hp then by all means get EFI Live, buy some books and get yourself educated on all the system components on a modern turbo diesel, and HAVE AT IT!!!
 
DangrousDuramax is right. For your particular situation, I'd go with a PPE tuner. They've got a couple canned tunes that'll get you over 500 to the rubber. Then add an intake, exhaust, and a tranny and you're good. Did I mention you'll have a VERY driveable 500 horse truck? She'll smoke like a freight train on the Hot +2 Eliminator tune, too. PPE's tunes are renowned for that.
 
DangrousDuramax said:
CTDYoungGun, if your looking to build a 500hp daily driver that does the occasional sled pull or race then you will be better off and much happier going with a plug-n-play tuner such as any of those previously stated. EFI Live gives you access to the tables of the tune and will get very complicated and overwelming very quick. It's best suited for racers and experienced tuners. If you have no experience tuning a diesel engine or understand every single component, sensor, and device on the truck then trying to use EFI Live will get you in trouble in a hurry. For what your wanting to do a plug-n-play programmer or box will be the better choice. BTW- you wont come anywhere near 500hp on a stock tranny. That needs to be the first thing you do. If you add a tuner before the tranny build, then dont go over 425hp. If you feel like you will become a hard core racer or puller and want to go over 500hp then by all means get EFI Live, buy some books and get yourself educated on all the system components on a modern turbo diesel, and HAVE AT IT!!!
Click to expand...


Good post.


IMHO, I'd stay under 450 RWHP. Not to say that you could but you might loose a rod over 450RWHP and engines are not cheap.
 
DangrousDuramax said:
CTDYoungGun, if your looking to build a 500hp daily driver that does the occasional sled pull or race then you will be better off and much happier going with a plug-n-play tuner such as any of those previously stated. EFI Live gives you access to the tables of the tune and will get very complicated and overwelming very quick. It's best suited for racers and experienced tuners. If you have no experience tuning a diesel engine or understand every single component, sensor, and device on the truck then trying to use EFI Live will get you in trouble in a hurry. For what your wanting to do a plug-n-play programmer or box will be the better choice. BTW- you wont come anywhere near 500hp on a stock tranny. That needs to be the first thing you do. If you add a tuner before the tranny build, then dont go over 425hp. If you feel like you will become a hard core racer or puller and want to go over 500hp then by all means get EFI Live, buy some books and get yourself educated on all the system components on a modern turbo diesel, and HAVE AT IT!!!
Click to expand...



not trying to be a smart a$$ at all, BUT i've been working on diesel engines for about 3 or 4 years...from semis to pickups...

i'm not saying I know all or even most of the things about all diesel engines, but i am very interested in learning to tune the d-max engine...

500hp wasn't a critical number either, just the # everybody had been saying the combo i wanted would make...i just want a B.A. daily driver/ puller and to be that around here it is probably going to take somewhere around 500 rwhp...seems like every joe-schmoe has a friggin chip and injectors around here...i want to be the "punk kid" that puts a spankin on the older guys with their banks powerpacks and the like...lol...sorry if that last one makes anybody mad...
 
efi live to make basic power you mess with less than 10 table period.
rods beign to give about 600 rwhp or on the addition of a second cp3 and bigger turbo. the stock cp3 will turn a A5k, 4088, 4094, htt and other comparble turbos

my truck is currently in for injectors at 92k on the od and some 4000 hours run time... is lots and lots of city driving. the warrentee is 7/200k from date of sell. this is the TSB number TSB 04-06-04-007G

tuning is easy.
throttle to rpm= fuel quantity(mm3) or how much fuel in cubic millimeters
mm3 to rail pressure= pulse width or how long the injectors are open

timing is the other table.
mm3 to rpm= how much timing :hint no more than 30* total timing is advised

the rest of the 10 table are rpm max, speed limiter, tcm/rpm limiter, and a few others.

the big thing like some on mention is no two truck tune like. on my like 28* max timing while another like 30* max... another is the tune's smooth ness greatly depend on the tuners ability to understand how the table interreact with each other to some extent

for 550 for V1 of EFI live or V2 for 750. it is the most power full tune that can grow with you truck when you add after market mods say turbo(s), N2O and what not. plus you can tune at the ready and do not have to wait for the hand held tuner or ecm to get updater....... which can be weeks or more.... less than 5 minute you can completely re-tune you truck. basily boils down to how much time you are willing to spend in learning or getting a tuen from some to help the learning curve. i got a basic one you can have if you do go that route iirc so cal diesel still stocks V1 of efi live.
the tts extreme and ppe hot2 et run 1000+ dollars..

you will need a tranny period pretty much anything above 100hp above stock you tranny is on a short fuse period! ats, suncoast, ppe trannies are my recomendations.

about the turbo it is a IHI turbo commmon power is 490-510 on #2 out of this depending on tuner and day it is dynoed. above 3000rpm this turbo start loosing boost and gaining egt in a hurry it is just plan out of its operating range.

the engine is rate at 1375* sustained egt. i can do less the 1375-1400* untill 2900-3000 rpm then the egt shoot to some 1700* but only in 5th gear.


diff between efi lvie
V1 good for anything from 97-05 v8 diesel and gas engines
V2 pretty much any GM engine from 97 to and current, 4, 6, 8 cylinder engines both gass and diesels
 
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