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JAS3+390

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Ok guys I searched the forums but haven't found a solid solution. I'm about to buy a 99 24v and when you turn the key on the wts light won't come on at least not right a way. If you bump the starter and stop it'll come on then crank right up. If you don't wait on the light it will just spin over and over and over. From what I found it doesn't seem grid heater related but not sure where to go next. Any help would be greatly appreciated. I don't wanna buy a truck that's gonna come with a huge expense immediately after. Especially since im not too 24v savy. Thanks in advance guys!
 
ECM failure.

THe ECM failure is typically causes the the WTS light not to light becausee the memory is corrupt in the ECM so it doesn't boot up in a timely fashion so the WTS light is lagging to light up. The cause of this is a bad alternator with excessive AC noise.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGaHaIXZioA
 
Will the alternator more than likely fix the issue or is the ECM most likely toast?
 
The owner said he replaced the alternator a few years ago but claimed it did it before and obviously it still is. Does the wts have anything to do with
STart up fueling to the pump? How high dollar is and ecm?
 
I didn't pay too close attention to hear it. Its just odd that if you bump the key then turn off and back on the wts will come on immediately and it'll fire right up.
 
The 99 ecm's are reaching there life expectancy. Look for a used 2000 or 2001 and get it flashed for your 99.

you should be up and running for under 4 bills.

I do not sell ecm's but I can flash it for you.
 
salvage yards are fine. just make sure you get an ecm not a pcm by mistake.

Mark is a good source.
 
Zspires94 said:
Will the alternator more than likely fix the issue or is the ECM most likely toast?
Click to expand...

JAS3+3 said:
The owner said he replaced the alternator a few years ago but claimed it did it before and obviously it still is. Does the wts have anything to do with
STart up fueling to the pump? How high dollar is and ecm?
Click to expand...

Alternator is the cause of the ECM failure. Then the ECM failure is just that a failure. I would still test out the alternator it should produce less than 0.1 AC Volts on the battery terminal of the alternator.

As for the WTS light that is a internal RAM issues of the ECM and its no longer properly capable of booting up in a timely manner. Nothing will function till AFTER the WTS light has come which is a sign of the software is booted up and ready to go. Before the WTS light the ECM is brain dead there is no lift pump nor the ablity to fire the VP44.

Once again refer back to the video about the alternator testing.

As for new alternators... LOL!

OK! Problem solved! Yippee!!!

Took the recently purchased Alternator back to O'Reilly's where I got it from, had them test it on their tester. They told me they run the test 3 times and if they get a PASS all three times, its a good alternator. When I asked about measuring AC Voltage, they looked dumbfounded, so I asked them if I could hook my multi-meter up to the alternator while they tested? They agreed! So now this alternator is reading .35 Volts AC as the first test PASS'S, they run the second test and we get a FAIL, the guy gives me a funny look, checks his wires and runs the third test and we get another FAIL. So the guy now rells me guess we have a bad alternator but they don't have another one on the shelf and I will need to wait till tomorrow to bring one in from the other store. I say, I'm OK with that, but that I've learned my lesson and we are going to have to test the next alternator as well before I leave the store with it. The next morning (yesterday) they call me and let me know the alternator is in and I can come down and pick it up. We do the test like before, and this time we get a PASS, PASS, PASS, however my multi-meter is reading 0.3 Volts AC, and then I also notice that on their machine there is a box at the top that says Diodes and across from that box on the screen says N/A. So I ask the guy about it and he says their machine has no way of testing the diodes, it only test for overall condition of the alternator. Unhappy with what I'm hearing and looking at, I request my money back which they had no problem with at all, however the core I earlier took in was no longer in the store so the gave me cash in the amount of $215.00 (their core charge on that alternator $36.00 along with the full purchace price of $179.00.)

By this time I have no core, only to find out all the other auto parts stores around town are charging a $70 - $80 core charge for this alterrnator, and a lot of the places have no tester. Starting to get a bit frustrated, I decided to quit messing around and go to the most reliable place in town I know of, a small family owned auto electric and mechanical shop (Auto Electric, Anchorage, Alaska). I was hoping that maybe they had heard of this isuue I am having with the TCL and get fixed up with a good alternator. They rebuild all kinds of auto electrical parts right there in house as well a run a full service auto mechanic shop. Well,,,,I explained my problem to them and showed them a printed copy of the troubleshooting procedure I got from the Mopa1973Man website, to which they said...never heard of this before. However these guys are real pro's and they didn't blow me off. They took my concerns seriously, brought two techs in out of the shop to talk with me about this, as I explainded to them the 0.1 Volt AC upper limit thing. They genuinly got concerned and were pulling down alternators, checking them on the bench and checking outputs at vehicles in the shop. In all, I was in there for about two hours while they tested and discussed and in the end the shop found me a NEW alternator and gave me a heck of a deal @ $239.00 w/no core charge. The NEW alternator was putting out 0.22 Volts AC on their alternator bench vise, and that concerned me cause I was looking for something under 0.1 VAC. However in further discussion, the techs I was working with concluded, (and BTW they turned out to be right), that the test machine itself was putting off AC Noise and that the Fluke Meter was picking up that AC Noise during the test, and that since the Voltage Regulator is on either the PCM or ECM, the only way to accuratly read out the AC output on this alternator was to put it on the vehicle and measure it at that time. So,,,I took the alternator home, hooked it all up, and WALLA... measured at the battries -0.01 Volts AC @idle, and 0.00 Volts AC @2000 RPM. Feeling pretty good at this point I take it for a test drive. Runs and shifts perfectly. NO MORE PROBLEMS!!!

Cory, I believe he's the manger or maybe owner, at Auto Electric said though he's heard and dealt with a lot of Dodge Cummins issues like this before, had never heard of this shifting problem being linked to + 0.10 VAC output on the alternator. He asked me to check back in with him to let him know how all this worked out. I will do that on Monday, as well as express my thanks for all the personal attention, efforts and concerns Auto Electric gave to me to adress my problem.

In the meantime, my utmost gratitude to Mopar1973Man for sharing your knoweledge and wisdom on this issue. I had tried all the bandaid tricks only to have them each work for anywhere to a couple hours to a couple days or so and then reappear. I believe what was happening was that as I fixed a ground or foiled a wire, it masked the problem just long enough for the diodes on the alternator to get a little worse and then BOOM, the problem is back!

Very good information Mopar1973Man!!!
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My 98.5 does the same thing. I just wait ~5 seconds til WTS light comes on then start it. My battery gauge fluxuates for a few minutes after start up but then steadies out. I figure ill run it til it quits.
 
dieselbeef said:
that's some dammmmm good info right there..thank u sir
Click to expand...

Not a problem I've been chasing VP44 failures, ECM failures and found the cause between BD noise filters used on the PCM for TQ converter lock up issues and the alternator that has already failed. So back up the train for a moment. Now remember back in the 1960's and 1970's when we had big blocks and muscle cars? Well back then the only electroincs we had was the stereo (mostly AM). So when a alternator diode failed then you use to heard the whine of the alternator through the AM radio. The rest of the vehicle was a few electric motors (wipre and blower) and some light bulbs.Today with all the CPU's and fine electronics it takes very very little AC voltage ripple to distroy a device on our truck ECM, PCM or VP44. So typically I ask about AC noise / voltage tests. It won't do any good to cover up the problem with tin foil, BD noise filter, ground wire mods, etc till you fix the actual problem which typically 99.9% of the time is a bad alternator.
 
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All of this is super great info! This will be my first 24v truck so it maybe a dumb question but where is the ecm and PCM located? I am going to get the truck today so very soon I will do the ac tests and either a. Deal with the light or b. Get and ecm. Y'all have been a huge help!
 
JAS3+3 said:
All of this is super great info! This will be my first 24v truck so it maybe a dumb question but where is the ecm and PCM located? I am going to get the truck today so very soon I will do the ac tests and either a. Deal with the light or b. Get and ecm. Y'all have been a huge help!
Click to expand...

ECM is on driver side of engine block, and PCM is on passenger side firewall under hood.
 
For fun here is the ECM guts...

This has the processor , RAM (Memory) and the PROM (Programmable Read Only Memory) on this side...
post-2-138698195806.jpg


Here is the other half with the master plug and other circuits.
post-2-138698195813.jpg


It's a true computer and it has to be treated as such with clean power and good grounds.
 
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Check the iat sensor before replacing the ecm. I at controls when and how long the wait to start light comes on
 
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