where to start, building a pulling motor

It's not the same ECM...Dodge uses Cummins ECM, and they are a lot more picky about who get's the programming to tune them. GM sticks with a Delphi unit )I think) and anyone with EFI live can tune them...been around forever in the gasser world.

The fuel system can handle the RPM, but the computers won't let them. A Duramax's " tuning tables" only go to 4800RPM, after that things get tricky...in my understanding!

Chris
 
Stupid question, could the injectors open and close that fast to turn 5500-6000? Or is it just a turn issue
 
Signature600 said:
Never heard that before...maybe one of the CR guys will chime in and educate us.

And I'm with you, if that's the case, I'll change my mind;)
Chris
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The 5.9L CR's are forged rods, but the new 6.7L's are powder metal rods. Also in the 6.7L's the wrist pin is moved up in the piston to create the longer stroke and is changing the angle on the rods providing more stress. I have heard that the 6.7L PMR's are bending at 900hp and the 5.9L CR forged rods are just fine at 1200-1300hp (They will probably take more, just no one has made that much HP yet :evil .) No one to my knowledge is building billet rods, but we are working on that. As for what rods to use in your motor build, I think all the rods are exactly the same exept for the 6.7L PMR's, right?
 
I stand corrected, there is one manufacturer that is building billet rods. They are known for quality, but they're also pricey. And yes all the connecting rods are the same in all years and both the 5.9L and the 6.7L (according to that manufacturer). So with that I would say get you a set of good rods and build some power. If your not gonna be over 1000hp the stock rods will be just fine.
 
97crewcab said:
Who has a 900hp 6.7?
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Don't remember his name, he was running 5.9L brains though. He actually put new rods in it after he bent those ones. Then he broke a rod at just over 1000hp.
 
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Soup Nazi




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Posts: 403 Hey Bean,

Not sure how far you guys want to take the 6.7, but I highly suggest you put some rods in it The dang things bend around 900 and fly out of the block over 1000. Just a heads up to save ya some cash in the long run Man.

The pistons were even lightened up the second go round and it still came apart.
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Soup Nazi




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Posts: 403 . The first one bent the rods this spring. About a week later after the engine was put back together with new rods and lighter pistons it basically EXPLODED!!! Pieces of the rod came out of the block so hard and fast that it removed the power steering pump from the engine on the way out.

The big engines spool turbos really well!!!


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11-13-2007, 08:47 PM #9
silverbullet


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Posts: 58 Blue, I think he's talking about Richard Brown's truck. He's the one that's been messing with them.
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11-13-2007, 08:56 PM #10
Soup Nazi




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Originally Posted by silverbullet
Blue, I think he's talking about Richard Brown's truck. He's the one that's been messing with them.


Bingo, we have a winner!
 
WOW, I was all excited to get a bunch of replies to my question....

Initially some good info. Then I was disappointed to see the thread had tangented off into BFE about CR motors.

By the way it's not worth discussing the PMR problem, THEY'RE JUNK!!! When I worked for GM and they first showed up 10 years ago. They would break in new engines on the NVI for no apparent reason. The Cadillac Northstar engine uses them, don't stamp or scribe numbers into them, and never wash them in the solvent tank. They will hold and then release solvents diluting the oil cushion between moving parts. Scribing them causes them to break like glass! PMR (Metal Dust Rods) are a way to make more dense metal rod by using scrap materials to appease profit hungry shareholders. The PMR problem is that the false bonds that hold the rod together fail due to the huge stresses they encounter (lets not forget they're basically dust to begin with), PM tecnology is good however for some non rotating parts, such as the rocker pedestals on the 12v.

It's like particle board connecting rods for your engine!
 
Yeah, it seems to me that they are pretty much worthless in a diesel motor or any motor for that matter. It frustrates me to see that Cummins, a company who is known for building a motor you can count on, would degrade themselves enough to use those junk connecting rods. But sorry for the derailment of your thread. Back to the important stuff.
 
On that note, here are my suggestions. Port the head, and fired ring, have the head flowed on both the intake and exhaust ports. Call a well known injection company such as haisly or shieds and ask them what they think you should do on the mods to the pump. I would still go with a p-pump, but if you what to break a VE pump record, then go for it. After the pump mods call them back and tell them what you have done to the pump along with the flow #'s of the head and the turbo setup and have custom injectors made to work as close as possible to your setup. It also wouldn't hurt to have an after market cam or even a custom ground. Don't forget all the other things so that the engine will stay together. Valvesprings and hardware, pushrods, Enterprise Engine has a pretty nice billet rocker arm assembly, though it is pricey, and your stockers should do just fine. THough it could be added insurance. Arias or Ross pistons will probably be a must since your egt's and the amount of added power you will have would just torture the stock pistons. I would also go with a Fluidampr and a Main stud kit with a main stud girdle as well. Better safe than sorry. Its not very hard to make alot of HP with these engines, its just getting all the little things to keep them together that will eat into your pocket.
 
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SEOH...good info...although all the CR rods are a fracture split cap design, which is stronger and different that the 12v and 24v VP's. Looks like 5.9 CR rods is what I would suggest!

I got most of my info about rods before the 6.7L came out...that's why I didn't know about the PMR's!

Chris
 
kino_fab said:
On that note, here are my suggestions. Port the head, and fired ring, have the head flowed on both the intake and exhaust ports. Call a well known injection company such as haisly or shieds and ask them what they think you should do on the mods to the pump. I would still go with a p-pump, but if you what to break a VE pump record, then go for it. After the pump mods call them back and tell them what you have done to the pump along with the flow #'s of the head and the turbo setup and have custom injectors made to work as close as possible to your setup. It also wouldn't hurt to have an after market cam or even a custom ground. Don't forget all the other things so that the engine will stay together. Valvesprings and hardware, pushrods, Enterprise Engine has a pretty nice billet rocker arm assembly, though it is pricey, and your stockers should do just fine. THough it could be added insurance. Arias or Ross pistons will probably be a must since your egt's and the amount of added power you will have would just torture the stock pistons. I would also go with a Fluidampr and a Main stud kit with a main stud girdle as well. Better safe than sorry. Its not very hard to make alot of HP with these engines, its just getting all the little things to keep them together that will eat into your pocket.
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I think those are some good points to look at. I figure these motors need air so my thinking is to focus on 700 HP or so in choosing a cam and a turbo. What are your thoughts on a GT4202 or GT4294? A theoretical start point of the build?
 
ford69557ci said:
keep the ve i have a ve flowing 520cc now and i have not got my higher lift camplate in the mail yet that should lead to some good power numbers i do a little pullin but am plannin on killin the ve power record so kta can have an excuse to get ol yellow back goin
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I entertained this idea in a thread on DTR. I am curious about the source of your high lift plate? PM me.
 
I never was good on picking turbo's. I have tried to come up with high HP setups before and then ask about others thoughts on how it would work, and I would be way off on the turbo. Probably the best person to ask on here would be Mr. Weston (Smokem). He builds custom chargers if I am not mistaken and can lead you in the right direction. I would start with the basics and go ahead and build up the bottom end. Get the rotating assembly ballanced and lower compression pistons alredy fly cut to clear if you go with a bigger cam.
 
We seem to think alike. I want to build the bottom end heavy just in case I find that bucket of money I've been looking for. But, even building the bottom end is going to tie itself to the charger and the spray pattern/timing of the sticks, being that the pistons have to work with them.
 
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