EFILive For Common Rail Dodges!!!

joefarmer

joefarmer

MR. Supreme Overlord
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Jul 31, 2006
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Kind of a catchy thread title, right?

How about using MegaSquirt to control a Common Rail Cummins? I mean, it supports unlimited inputs/outputs, right? Plus, we can cheat and mock up the lookup tables from EFILive for Chevy. Now all I need is a Common Rail and money... who's in?

brandon.
 
hmmm

:st: :ft: I got a common rail but how sure are you about this stuff working?? My '06 has just over 1000 miles on it and just rolled off the dealer parking lot a week ago... So I will only use what works, not to much experimenting, unless its a for sure operation...:ft: :st:
 
I had the same idea approx. one week ago.

I think with manual tranny it might work, but I am interested to use with automatic.
 
Ok excuse my ingnorance but what is the deal with Dodge and why they cant develop efi live for it. I know very little about these new common rails. Does Dodge lock the ECM somehow so it wont work?

Andy
 
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MegaSquirt is a standalone controller. In otherwords, it's a complete replacement for the Dodge/Cummins ECM. All the sensors (inputs) and outputs would need to be wired to the standalone controller. It's also open source meaning the existing code for other EFI systems is shared and could be used to help code the CR system.

brandon.
 
Dazed&Confused said:
Ok excuse my ingnorance but what is the deal with Dodge and why they cant develop efi live for it. I know very little about these new common rails. Does Dodge lock the ECM somehow so it wont work?

Andy
Click to expand...

Cummins has a protection rights on the programming in the ECM.

Thats why the Smarty is allegedly made in Italy.
 
joefarmer said:
MegaSquirt is a standalone controller. In otherwords, it's a complete replacement for the Dodge/Cummins ECM. All the sensors (inputs) and outputs would need to be wired to the standalone controller. It's also open source meaning the existing code for other EFI systems is shared and could be used to help code the CR system.

brandon.
Click to expand...

So then, the programming would have to be done from a clean slate?
 
MKoth said:
Cummins has a protection rights on the programming in the ECM.

Thats why the Smarty is allegedly made in Italy.
Click to expand...

Ok so is it like a protected patent, or do they just lock the ECM. What I'm trying to ask I guess is it illegal to tamper with there settings?

Andy
 
I think the hardest part will be building the map for the motor. You have have to understand what ALL the inputs will do, and adjust to them accordingly.

however, I don't think that the Megasquirt has enough precision to control a CI engine. There's much more leeway on an SI engine.
 
Dazed&Confused said:
What I'm trying to ask I guess is it illegal to tamper with there settings?

Andy
Click to expand...

From what I understand, yes.

But, if you start with a blank controller, you could do pretty much whatever you want.
 
MKoth said:
From what I understand, yes.

But, if you start with a blank controller, you could do pretty much whatever you want.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the enlightenment!

Andy
 
I talked to my hookup at Cummins and he said they are on LOCKDOWN when it comes to the software. he is one of the peeps that sets up the maps and what not and he said that he likes his job way too much to even talk to me about what it would take to get around it.
 
edgerat said:
I talked to my hookup at Cummins and he said they are on LOCKDOWN when it comes to the software. he is one of the peeps that sets up the maps and what not and he said that he likes his job way too much to even talk to me about what it would take to get around it.
Click to expand...

If there is enough
pile%20of%20cash%20or%20money.jpg
it can be done...
 
As I understood it NO there is no chance of an inside man helping. You have to sign waivers and what not. They have to sign one of those "if you invent something when you work here, it belongs to US" thingies.
 
Well, let me pose this question: Cummins has spent thousands upon thousands of man hours writing the calibration.

Why go back and mess with everything? What advantage is there to write a completely new map?

All we need to do is alter the existing map....using Mega Squirt, you're reinventing the wheel.

And on top of that, it doesn't have the code to drive the injectors. It's not fast enough. And you'd have to run all new sensors too...why bother?

The advantages of writing a new map is outside the realm of megasquirt.

And, on top of that, Megasquirt says that it's design for spark ignition engines.
 
Why? >5k RPM & total control. You don't need that much of the map to get started. The base is determined with an o-scope. If you've ever seen EFILive, you can see that most of the information is already there. Here's the main tables that I tune with in EFILive:

Throttle Base Injection (RPM vs TPS%) mm3/cyl/stroke.
Pilot Injection Pulse (mm3/cyl/stroke vs rail pressure) milliseconds of injector duration
Main Injection Pulse "
Injection Timing (mm3/cyl/stroke vs RPM) crank angle degrees
Pilot Timing "
Fuel Pressure Base (mm3/cyl/stroke vs RPM) MPa

brandon.
 
I'd be game to try this sort of thing with my HPCR Cummins...but it'll be a while until that engine is actually in the vehicle. :bang (It would also have to play nice with the Allison LCT-1000 behind it.)

Matt
 
joefarmer said:
Why? >5k RPM & total control. You don't need that much of the map to get started. The base is determined with an o-scope. If you've ever seen EFILive, you can see that most of the information is already there. Here's the main tables that I tune with in EFILive:

Throttle Base Injection (RPM vs TPS%) mm3/cyl/stroke.
Pilot Injection Pulse (mm3/cyl/stroke vs rail pressure) milliseconds of injector duration
Main Injection Pulse "
Injection Timing (mm3/cyl/stroke vs RPM) crank angle degrees
Pilot Timing "
Fuel Pressure Base (mm3/cyl/stroke vs RPM) MPa

brandon.
Click to expand...

I thought that EFI live was going to have something for the ISBe "in the near future"...which was last spring. What happened?
 
Matt- that Jeep Project you have going on sounds pretty neat, do you have pics of this swap?
 
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