ICP gauge

outlaw6oh said:
X2 that's so redneck even rednecks wouldn't admit to doing thatLOL
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So when you have a case of a possible lube oil circuit issue, and you need to check and see if you're getting the tale tell signs, like a twitchy hpo pressure gauge needle..... what would you do?

Or are you incapable of diagnosing such a thing, and merely take the truck to someone who can?

Honest question. Because I don't see any other way to get the data you need in a safer, or less expensive manner. You do realize that it's okay to cut the zip-ties and remove the gauge once the testing is completed right?

Besides, I thought the topic was "ICP gauge". I didn't know it was, pretty looking ICP gauge, that mounts permanently, and may or may not show what I actually needed the gauge for in the first place.
 
I would be interested in seeing if the oscillations with aeration could be seen with an ISSPRO Performax datalogger. What causes the aeration problems?

Regards,
Michael Pliska
 
Below shows the fluctuation of our Isspro gauges. This was a run at the track. The data logger records 5 times per second. The actual gauge moves quicker.
9:40:02 PM 750.1
9:40:02 PM 904.4
9:40:03 PM 981.5
9:40:03 PM 885.1
9:40:03 PM 654.3
9:40:03 PM 827.3
9:40:03 PM 1058
9:40:04 PM 981.5
9:40:04 PM 942.9
9:40:04 PM 981.5
9:40:04 PM 1000.8
9:40:04 PM 2213
9:40:05 PM 3714.4
9:40:05 PM 3771.7
9:40:05 PM 3714.4
9:40:06 PM 3733.7
9:40:06 PM 3752.4
9:40:06 PM 3791
9:40:06 PM 3791
9:40:07 PM 3771.7
9:40:07 PM 3810.2
9:40:08 PM 3791
9:40:08 PM 3771.7
9:40:08 PM 3810.2
9:40:08 PM 3791
9:40:09 PM 3791
9:40:09 PM 3791
9:40:09 PM 3810.2
9:40:09 PM 3771.7
9:40:09 PM 3791
9:40:10 PM 3733.7
9:40:10 PM 2270.8
9:40:10 PM 3810.2
9:40:10 PM 3791
9:40:10 PM 3810.2
9:40:11 PM 3791
9:40:11 PM 3752.4
9:40:12 PM 3771.7
9:40:12 PM 3791
9:40:12 PM 3771.7
9:40:12 PM 3771.7
9:40:12 PM 3771.7
9:40:13 PM 3771.7
9:40:13 PM 3791
9:40:13 PM 3771.7
9:40:13 PM 3791
9:40:13 PM 3752.4
9:40:14 PM 3752.4
9:40:14 PM 3810.2
9:40:14 PM 3829.5
9:40:14 PM 3791
9:40:15 PM 3733.7
9:40:15 PM 3752.4
9:40:16 PM 3771.7
9:40:16 PM 3791
9:40:16 PM 3810.2
9:40:16 PM 3810.2
9:40:16 PM 3733.7
9:40:17 PM 3752.4
9:40:17 PM 3252.3
9:40:17 PM 1385.2
9:40:17 PM 1327.9
9:40:18 PM 730.9
9:40:18 PM 788.7
9:40:18 PM 885.1
 
Extended Power said:
Ok...we have been talking about the ICP on our trucks, and what it needs to be at for our trucks to run properly.
Some of the more "Seasoned" members have stated that if you use AE software, it will give you false readings of only around 1700-1800psi.

My questions, which gauges are available to us, who has them installed, where do you have it installed, and where did you tie in for the sensing line?
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From the sounds of it he's not looking for ghetto installsLOL, not saying yours isn't functional just isn't something someone would want to drive around with a permanently attached gauge to the antenna.

And yes I take mine in to a good friend in the diesel industry, doesn't everyone have connections to take their truck to:what:
 
Charles said:
It's not physically possible for it to keep up with high frequency pressure flutters.... sorry. It's not in the cards. Explain to me exactly how you would know the fluctuations you're missing when you don't have a mechanical gauge to see them with? (scratches head)

lol.

And you leave the gauge outside the cab. I always just zip-tied it to the antenna.



On Edit:

Here ya go...

2579722550082519711S600x600Q85.jpg


High and low pressure.
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Holy hell WTF were you thinking? You sure you don't sled pull? LOL
 
Charles said:
Try that test on a truck that actually needs a gauge on it, not just on one using a gauge for fun, and for maximum value readings (that could have been acquired through a datalog anyway).

Like, on a truck with an oil aeration issue. The gauge will move and shudder INSANELY quickly. Approaching speeds that the human eye cannot perceive. I know watching the mech gauge flutter on the flowbench, at times it shudders into a blurry needle.

What is your drive system for the electric sweep gauge? Stepper? I just don't see it showing these things with great clarity, if at all.

That's all I'm saying. If so, great. Then choose to pay for the electric for reasons of style. But I don't see it capturing and displaying the same data in the same useful way.
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Trouble is, can you tell if it is just a harmonic in a under-damped or junk gauge. Oh wait you are using it to detect aerated oil so therefore your pressure readings are already skewed from the entrained air...
 
SINNER said:
Trouble is, can you tell if it is just a harmonic in a under-damped or junk gauge. Oh wait you are using it to detect aerated oil so therefore your pressure readings are already skewed from the entrained air...
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Yeah, we just hold the rpm at 2k for 2 minutes. Pull the dipstick. if it has bubbles, then it has aerated oil and you do an oil change.
 
Trusted said:
Yeah, we just hold the rpm at 2k for 2 minutes. Pull the dipstick. if it has bubbles, then it has aerated oil and you do an oil change.
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Andy, you hafta change the oil if it is aerated? What causes the oil to get aerated...does it just happen when the crank case is over filled?
 
If I had to guess, I'd say I'm the only one in this thread that has actually used a gauge to accurately diagnose, and then fix an oil system problem of the sort most of you would be oblivious to in the first place.

It is obvious to me that you all refuse to admit that a simple mech gauge is at once less expensive and more functional than the electric unit, for reasons I cannot grasp at this time. You all also don't seem capable of understanding that the mech gauge is TEMPORARY. Much like plugging a scanner into an OBD port to take readings. Do you downplay the use of a scanner because of the way it looks sitting on the seat of a truck, and talk about how "ghetto" the wires look laying across the floor and seat? Hopefully not, hopefully you could see that it is a temporary diagnostic tool. The fact that a mech gauge can be installed and removed in under 5 minutes solidifies it's place in this category.

I have had lube oil pumps, a front cover and a pickup tube all go south on me causing lube oil circuit aeration. An astute driver would detect subtle nuances which might prompt him to test for such things. I suspect those having replied toward the mech gauge unfavorably would not fall into this category in the first place. As such, I find myself trying to explain something to people who don't know, or care to understand in the first place.

Enjoy your gauges. I have talked to Michael at length before on other topics, and he is a sharp guy. I have no doubt that the gauge is of high quality and commendable style.

Enjoy.
 
Charles said:
If I had to guess, I'd say I'm the only one in this thread that has actually used a gauge to accurately diagnose, and then fix an oil system problem of the sort most of you would be oblivious to in the first place.

It is obvious to me that you all refuse to admit that a simple mech gauge is at once less expensive and more functional than the electric unit, for reasons I cannot grasp at this time. You all also don't seem capable of understanding that the mech gauge is TEMPORARY. Much like plugging a scanner into an OBD port to take readings. Do you downplay the use of a scanner because of the way it looks sitting on the seat of a truck, and talk about how "ghetto" the wires look laying across the floor and seat? Hopefully not, hopefully you could see that it is a temporary diagnostic tool. The fact that a mech gauge can be installed and removed in under 5 minutes solidifies it's place in this category.

I have had lube oil pumps, a front cover and a pickup tube all go south on me causing lube oil circuit aeration. An astute driver would detect subtle nuances which might prompt him to test for such things. I suspect those having replied toward the mech gauge unfavorably would not fall into this category in the first place. As such, I find myself trying to explain something to people who don't know, or care to understand in the first place.

Enjoy your gauges. I have talked to Michael at length before on other topics, and he is a sharp guy. I have no doubt that the gauge is of high quality and commendable style.

Enjoy.
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We use temp gauges all the time. That is the easiest and fastest way to diag most things. In fact, if you look at my truck, you would think I’m probably one of the biggest rednecks around. I have three gauges laying on the floor in the back of my truck hooked up to the fuel system, two on my dash with black tap holding them in place and 4 mounted on the A-pillar.

Your comment was that a mechanical gauge was faster and more accurate than an electrical one. That is where we came in and threw a flag. I don’t believe that. We are able to diagnose many things with our electrical gauge and I find it hard to believe that there are things we are not able to see/diag with it that you would be with a mechanical gauge. Now if you were refereeing to an EGT or something else, yeah, I would probably agree, but the ICP gauges are very quick.

As far as your lube oil pumps, front cover and pick up tube, we always try and start at the source. Oil aeration is usually detected by seeing air bubbles on the dip stick. If you have that, then there is no need to look at the high pressure oil. It is either bad oil or a problem with the lower end.
 
strokin6L said:
Andy, you hafta change the oil if it is aerated? What causes the oil to get aerated...does it just happen when the crank case is over filled?
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99% of the time it is caused from oil break down. You can put some anti foam in the oil but in our opinion, we always change it. If it happens a lot, we would recommend someone going to a high grade synthetic like Royal Purple.

Every once and a great while, like Charles mentioned above, something in the low oil pressure system fails and starts sucking in air, causing aeration.

I believe that this is more common to find the 7.3 aerating oil than a 6.0.
 
No one here seems to mention that a good mechanical gauge is more expensive than most if not all electrics, and the inherent resolution loss on high PSI gauges due to the limits of sweep and the extreme range of pressure. When I am looking for minute pressure changes at high working pressures I seem to go for a digital almost 100% of the time.
 
SINNER said:
No one here seems to mention that a good mechanical gauge is more expensive than most if not all electrics, and the inherent resolution loss on high PSI gauges due to the limits of sweep and the extreme range of pressure. When I am looking for minute pressure changes at high working pressures I seem to go for a digital almost 100% of the time.
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Well then, in that case, your human factors engineering grade for the day is F.

Incremental change, yes, sporadic fluctuation.... no. For that, you must have analog, and high res analog at that. A non-dampened mech gauge, fully capable of all of this will run less than 50 dollars. 3 to 5 feet of hose and associated fittings will not cost the amount needed to make a mech setup remotely as expensive as an electric gauge.

The desire for a digital instrument to detect rapid, multi-directional changes, such as is the case with ICP is foolish. It shows a lack of understanding. Plain and simple.
 
Superchuck can detect 50 psi changes on a gauge with 100 psi increments in a single bound....LMFAO
 
What is the graduation on a 0 - 5000psi gauge within 270 degrees of sweep? Holding the RPM up and watching the IPR increase compensate for the aeration is a bad test because?
 
When I feel something that seems like an oil problem, a quick glance to the gauge reveals all. I'm not arguing on a conceptual level, I'm arguing from true-life experience. I've only been using this gauge off and on for about 4 years now.

I'm not the least bit unsure of how it works. It works flawlessly. Only issue to date was having a top seal pop out of one and the glycerin leak down a bit. You can absolutely see the most subtle disturbances to the system. VERY plainly.

While at the same time a scantool, even one logging, will show NOTHING... Yet it's plain to even a novice when watching the mech gauge.

It's not like I'm making this stuff up. I Just tried to offer an economical solution to the topic. One that works very well for the intended purpose, monitoring ICP.
 
Trusted said:
9:40:05 PM 3714.4
9:40:06 PM 3733.7
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So, sitting in the drivers seat, looking at a 4 or 5,000 psi mechanical gauge that is 5+ feet away, vibrating as you rev the engine up; you can see a difference of 20 psi in .20 seconds? I don't think so.

A mechanical gauge works for what you are doing. That needle flickers all around when there is a problem. We used to use them all the time and in fact, we are putting one on one of our trucks to see what is going on.

We are using one because of the price tag on the Isspro gauge. Not because we cannot see or diag the problem. The owner just doesn't have the money right now. If you can datalog what is going on, you can see a bunch of stuff that driving the truck you miss. I'm so glad that they came out with that feature. THANK YOU Michael :Cheer:
 
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