So whats the Next step in D-max Modification??

Super D............. got any tricks you'd like to divulge? Heck, how about just letting the viewers know HOW the Allison shifts, other than 1...2...3...4..5..6.
 
Burner said:
Code changing with the TCM is all great and wonderful.....but it won't solve hardware/physical problems.
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Better yet instead of talking about which C packs engage in which gear (which is meaning less and off topic). Why don't you explain why the TCM dosn't control the shifts in the Allison and the programming would be pointless? Or do you have any idea what in the world your even talking about? This is about which Mod is the next step isn't it? Lets hear why this is a pointless step (don't forget that the Allison is computer controled). Do you know how it works since your ripping on it (or are you just talking out of another area)? Is the 48RE and such, a better trans? How would it benifit us in it's function over the Allison? Should we figure out how to adapt them instead? If you can't answer I understand. Just looking for answers on the next step and why (instead of just slamming ideas unless that's the only thing you can do).
 
i tend to see what both burne and super diesel are trying to get at but the point remains as for what is next,it wont be discussed in an open forumn but you can bet it will be hitting a track or dyno near you soon.....


steve you gonna vaction in the florida panhandle the first of august?
 
I'm not ripping on the Allison, I like the Allison! I know what's there ...but not what 'exactly' needs to be re-worked for 9's or 8's. I do know that juice flows really fast and fluid & parts not so fast. There are limits right now. Bones, Diesel Tech, Ida-ho know I really like the trans and would love to see it better..... but there are limits right now. You'll should understand them in the next year or so.

ASTA
 
Had my ducks in a row.....plans got changed. :doh: Until 3 weeks ago the party "was" on the 11th and now it's on the 4th. I think they start to really remember at 4 years old.

If I took off leaving the wife with jumpy things, horses and cooking.....she'd kill me. *bdh*


What's going on Sunday?
 
Burner said:
Code changing with the TCM is all great and wonderful.....but it won't solve hardware/physical problems.
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yes it will IMO ;)

The "hardware/physical problems" are a result of TCM programming that is not designed to deal with 800rwhp shifts and increased apply rates....
 
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Burner said:
If you set a programmer to "defuel" between shifts you will not have any tie-ups.
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with transgo and other internal mods you will have tie ups (especially 3-4) no matter how much defuel. Defuel has nothing to do with it. Tie ups ARE aggrivated with less defuel and bigger power (which results in broken parts) but tie ups are not "because of no defuel".

The allison does not work like any other transmission out there. We are starting from scratch whereas the dodge guys are working with a transmission whos high performance experience started 30 years ago.

The TCM is critical to making everything work and the programming in it MUST be custom to account for the faster shifts and physical mods inside. The TCM was not designed to work with the physical mods we are doing, so we are in between a rock and a hard place as far as furthering development of internal mods. Are there more internal mods that can be made to better the trans? Im sure there are! But we cant do any of those mods until we have a TCM that supports them. It is so much more than just a 48re or 4L80/hydramatic idiot box whos only responsibility is to decide when to lock the converter and turn a couple solenoids on and off.

just my oppinion :)

ben
 
Ben, You know these transmissions well, as you should. You are correct that 'defuel' doesn't cause the tie-ups but it does put a LARGE damper in. Large amounts of power will cause internal transmission binding....because the damm transmission CANNOT shift any faster. Whooho about the TCM programming. *bdh* It will not solve the problem. It may help a little but not what folks are looking for.


Solenoids will fire at a given rate.....but the PARTS can only move so fast. Like you said "The Allison does not work like any other tranmssion out there".
 
Burner you PM box is full!:kick:

A buddy of mine just blew up this blown big block chevy drag truck. He wants to go with a built Dmax for power. He wants run an Allison also. I told him I was not sure that was the best trans to stick behind it right now. I was thinking 4R100 like Dockboy and Maddog use. From what I gather you can run it stand alone which means I can tune the ECM with a stick trans Operating system and use a seperate controller for the trans.

That sound like a good plan? Am I crazy thinking about not using the Allison?

Thanks
John
 
Drag truck?.......All drag truck? I'd use a Bruno or something.

...That is, unless you want all OEM stuff. If that's the path, I'd try a REALLY built 4L85E. I believe the Vans have an 85.
 
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Burner said:
Drag truck?.......All drag truck? I'd use a Bruno or something.

...That is, unless you want all OEM stuff. If that's the path, I'd try a REALLY built 4L85E. I believe the Vans have an 85.
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Thanks

He wants to a the built OEM route as he does want to street drive it. He amazed at how you can go from well mannered street engine to evil track buring monster with a diesel.

I told I would go built short block, HTT turbo, Dual pumps and EFI Live. That should get him deep 11s and be still decent around town.
:ft:
 
There are more tricks than most know of in building a hard-core Dmax. I would contact Kennedy Diesel or one of our other Vendors here for a build. A dmax will/can scatter parts real fast past 600 HP. :doh: eerrrr....that's RWHP. I think 600 RWHP would = 702 to 720 Crank HP.
 
I think the Alli is fine up to 750 hp. Anything above that is questionable because of mass and electronics.
 
Mike L. said:
I think the Alli is fine up to 750 hp. Anything above that is questionable because of mass and electronics.
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I was just typing the same question to you on Mcrats site.

Thanks Mike!
 
Burner said:
Solenoids will fire at a given rate.....but the PARTS can only move so fast. Like you said "The Allison does not work like any other tranmssion out there".
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The [trim] solenoids are not on/off. They are PWM. IMHO I dont think we have not reached the limit on exceeding the capability of parts (how fast they can move).

Tie ups happen because we have no control of release rates. Transgo mods and pressure mods inside the trans increase apply rates, but the TCM is still releasing (pulsing off) at rates designed for a stock trans. Faster apply rates without faster release rates to compliment them = tie ups.

People screwing around with TCM tuning in EFILive only further agrivates the problem because, again, EFIlive (at this time) can only modify apply rates. So you have transgo applying clutches faster....then people messing around and further quickening shifts thru software, and you get even worse problems. Thats why SOME people are even taking the internal transgo mods out of the trans. Or at least until we have some way of modding release rates.

The allison should not knock your teeth out on shifts. Shifts should be firm but not harsh...everyone thinks the harder the shifts the better. Yeah thats great for any other trans, but hard shifts on an allison mean that shifts are not happening properly and you are risking broken parts.

I will say this again.....further TCM tuning is the probably IMHO one of the more important things right now that will further the allison aftermarket/performance development.

I do not know this trans. These are only my oppinions...leave the hard facts for Mike or Brayden to discern.

ben
 
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I see you couldn't answer my question Burner. How does the 12V Dodges defuel on shifts to save the trans (or do they)? Beef is one the things the Alcohol and T/F guys love, not smaller, littler parts to go faster (just an example). Defuel is a BANDAID ONLY!
 
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