Spool/diverter valve opinions

Poulina

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Specifically the one BD makes, looking for real world experience with a dash of hypothesis about running one with a large single on the street. Pros? Cons?

I've done a fair bit of research but all answers seem to be on ancient setups or only pertaining to gas applications.

I find it interesting how BD has engineered theirs to close the volute leading to the biggest side of the turbine...

Thanks
 
No experience with them but I am curious why you think it should not close off the biggest side of the turbine?
 
No experience with them but I am curious why you think it should not close off the biggest side of the turbine?

I would assume it's a trade off.
The inside would allow for higher RPM but slower spool up.
The outside would allow for lower RPM but quicker spool, if you're assuming the same flow rate and velocity for both (which it should be relatively).
In that regard, I too am surprised they would go for trying to hit the inner side since the whole idea is for quicker spool up.

Now, one more thing, do they specifically tell you to place it that way? I would assume you could just rotate the spool valve 180deg, move studs, and be pushing the air towards the outer side.
 
It is a trade off but the entire point of the spool valve is to spool the turbo faster....not only spool it slightly faster on the larger side of the turbine housing. :confused:
 
It is a trade off but the entire point of the spool valve is to spool the turbo faster....not only spool it slightly faster on the larger side of the turbine housing. :confused:

Yeah, we're in agreement. I'm just asking, what makes you say they want to push air towards the inner side of the wheel? Is it in the instructions? Otherwise I feel like you could just rotate the spool valve.
 
Blocking off the inducer volute is the better option, I don't know what you are describing by saying inner side of the wheel. From my experience these spool valve/flanges can work, but durability/reliability is the true hurdle, and to be honest you would be better off with another solution, hence why I moved away from working on them.
 
I was thinking in terms of keeping heat towards the CHRA would make it spool quicker, but rereading my pre-caffeine posting, I really don't know what I was saying and don't think that would really change anything. Ignore it ;-)

I know you used to sell them, what were the failures you were seeing? Leaking around the valve post? Seizing in the closed position?
 
Yeah, we're in agreement. I'm just asking, what makes you say they want to push air towards the inner side of the wheel? Is it in the instructions? Otherwise I feel like you could just rotate the spool valve.

I was thinking you would want the the directed exhaust to hit the inducer first vs. the exducer. Even more increased velocity or nozzle effect to hit the turbine. Below is what I was told after digging for a technical answer.

Blocking off the inducer volute is the better option, I don't know what you are describing by saying inner side of the wheel. From my experience these spool valve/flanges can work, but durability/reliability is the true hurdle, and to be honest you would be better off with another solution, hence why I moved away from working on them.
 
They just dont work, you want to make power, not to spin turbo. It just makes backpressure, compressor is usually what makes slow spooling, blocking half the turbine side doesnt help that, actually makes compressor surge worse because engine is not breathing.
 
Just food fr thought. The new Tier4 CAT midsize engines are using a "balanced" turbo and there is an internal waste gate that seperates the two halves of the divided exhaust housing. when closed, the one side of the turbine housing is a smaller volume and it spools the turbo up. once its up to speed/boost the balance valve opens up making it act as a single housing. robust, ingenious, and i wish aftermarket would pick up on it.
 
Just food fr thought. The new Tier4 CAT midsize engines are using a "balanced" turbo and there is an internal waste gate that seperates the two halves of the divided exhaust housing. when closed, the one side of the turbine housing is a smaller volume and it spools the turbo up. once its up to speed/boost the balance valve opens up making it act as a single housing. robust, ingenious, and i wish aftermarket would pick up on it.

Pictures? Link?
 
Just food fr thought. The new Tier4 CAT midsize engines are using a "balanced" turbo and there is an internal waste gate that seperates the two halves of the divided exhaust housing. when closed, the one side of the turbine housing is a smaller volume and it spools the turbo up. once its up to speed/boost the balance valve opens up making it act as a single housing. robust, ingenious, and i wish aftermarket would pick up on it.
It's a real neat setup isn't it!?

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk
 
This is directly off bd's wedbsite, actually a screenshot of the install instructions. The actuator is enormous and may not clear the flipped manifold. Hopefully it clears my straight flange steed and drive pressure gauge line...
 

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On Todd's Frankenstein Triple Turbo build/truck, we tried a BD Spool Flange on the GTX42 turbo mounted on the manifold. It helped spoolup, especially when trying to build boost against a tight converter at high altitude, and it worked well when tuned properly to open at the right time during spoolup to allow the truck to gain boost/power and not get a flat spot in the power curve from the valve opening too late creating unnecessary back pressure or opening too early and letting the truck fall on it's face down low.

Once it was tuned perfect (using regulators), it worked EXCELLENT for about 50 to 75 miles, then it filled with soot, quit actuating smoothly, and eventually stuck half open. We tore it down, cleaned the soot, and once again experienced EXCELLENT results, for about 25 miles, then it filled with soot, quit actuating smoothly, and stuck 1/4 way open. We freed the stuck vein/flap with some external lubricant applied to the flap/shaft and that lasted about 5 miles, then it stuck mostly closed, burned out the center divider of the turbine housing from the diverter valve sending hot exhaust directly at the center of the divided housing, fragments of cast housing went through the EXPENSIVE GTX4202 turbine wheel and ruined the turbo.

After several thousand dollars wasted to replace the GTX turbo, we went back without the BD Diverter Valve and installed a higher stall torque converter and tighter AR turbine housing on the GTX4202 and ended up with acceptable spoolup, nearly identical peak HP potential, and no more melted dividers.

Now this was a somewhat extreme application in that it was used on a 1000+ HP triple turbo setup, but the early failure makes me wonder if the diverter valve would last even 6 months on a 600 HP setup. Maybe with a gas engine with lower soot output it would hold up for a while, but I don't think it will provide reliable service on a sooty diesel engine.
 
Pardon an inexperienced question, but then how do waste gates and vgt systems stay clean of soot? The actuator on the diverter valve didn't have enough surface area via boost pressure to overcome built up soot deposits?

How many cc's of fuel is Todd pushing through that cylinder head? That truck sure seems like a good mule to test the longevity of any hard part. Sorry to hear it cost a gtx to figure that out.
 
Pardon an inexperienced question, but then how do waste gates and vgt systems stay clean of soot? The actuator on the diverter valve didn't have enough surface area via boost pressure to overcome built up soot deposits?

How many cc's of fuel is Todd pushing through that cylinder head? That truck sure seems like a good mule to test the longevity of any hard part. Sorry to hear it cost a gtx to figure that out.
They dont stay clean forever. They get sooted up also.
 
Just food fr thought. The new Tier4 CAT midsize engines are using a "balanced" turbo and there is an internal waste gate that seperates the two halves of the divided exhaust housing. when closed, the one side of the turbine housing is a smaller volume and it spools the turbo up. once its up to speed/boost the balance valve opens up making it act as a single housing. robust, ingenious, and i wish aftermarket would pick up on it.

My compounds have had something similar for over 2 years now.
 
Pardon an inexperienced question, but then how do waste gates and vgt systems stay clean of soot? The actuator on the diverter valve didn't have enough surface area via boost pressure to overcome built up soot deposits?

How many cc's of fuel is Todd pushing through that cylinder head? That truck sure seems like a good mule to test the longevity of any hard part. Sorry to hear it cost a gtx to figure that out.

Wastegates seem to last many many miles. Maybe because they are so close to the tubine and the heat bakes off the soot? I'm not sure.

VGT's usually start lacking in performance (at a relatively low power level) around 50,000. Not to say they completely stick or fail, but they could definitely stand to be cleaned. There are countless videos on how to clean 6.0L veins on YouTube.
 
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