Using compressed air to aid spooling of big singles.

sinfulcoin

sinfulcoin

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Joined
Jul 25, 2008
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247
Hey guys I have been digging into turbo research and came across so stuff on indy cars using CO2 to assist in spooling of their turbos. I was curious if anyone had tried using compressed air. Would the rate of temp change hurt the EX wheels. I was thinking about this when I remembered an EN1 that I knew while I was in the Navy and he had stated that this was done on some of the bigger engines that were once in locomotives. Anythoughts?
 
I have though about this for a long time. I think spraying compressed air directly at the comp. wheel from a few inches away should help tremendously with spooling. I have been toying with this idea for a while, and I say TRY IT!
 
Limited said:
I have though about this for a long time. I think spraying compressed air directly at the comp. wheel from a few inches away should help tremendously with spooling. I have been toying with this idea for a while, and I say TRY IT!
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It would need to be sprayed onto the exhaust wheel not the compressor wheel. Especially if it was CO2. I would really like to try it though. I have thought about it as well. Im not sure what the best way to go about it would be though. Not sure if just drilling and tapping the exhaust housing would work alright? Kind of a redneck idea but it would be fun to try it I think.
 
I had thought about drilling holes into the manifold on an angle so as to match the exhaust housing entrance and then using a solenoid operated valve and blow about 200psi at it. I just would not want to try it say during a run with the wheel at say 1600 degrees. I think it would come apart due to the rapid temp change. I have a bunch of stuff laying around from working on industrial air compressors and might get a wild hair to do this. Anybody got a junk big charger laying around?
 
We've been talking about this for quite awhile but have never really needed to do it, I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work, the only X factor is the valving set-up. Shooting cold air into the manifold is basically just upping the lb/min coming out of the engine making the turbo think it's hanging off something quite a bit larger, once the air hit the manifold the dense cold air would expand greatly so you won't have to shoot that much air to make a big difference. Not only would this help with spooling a larger turbo, but it would also help sled pullers from falling under the turbo at the end of the track. I'm assuming you'll be using an external waste gate to keep the drive pressure in check while you're dialing in the amount of air being introduced to the manifold? post up some pics/results when you do it.
 
I was also thinking of this but I was thinking of compressed nitrogen, but the gas shouldn't matter. I thought a big rig used that set-up to climb Pikes Peak?
 
Smokem said:
Are you going to tow a trailer for a tank that is large enough to handle this task? It was tried many, many years ago.
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Really? Who? I've never even heard of someone trying something like this. So spraying from say, a 10 gal. tank would make little or no difference to spool a larger charger? I find that tough to believe but it wouldn't be the 1st time I've been declared wrong. :hehe:
 
Smokem said:
Are you going to tow a trailer for a tank that is large enough to handle this task? It was tried many, many years ago.
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I was thinking about using it to get the charger spooled initially. The only application I can possibly see it working in would be on an automatic puller with a big single.
 
Pull Out your Diesel Power Mags the one with the 6 Turbo 903 Cummins Get in Contact with that owner cause it is spooled up with Compressed Air. I don't know what issue it is.
 
Alright here is said experiment. My brother bought a '96 2wd auto. I want to hang a big freaking charger on it. I planned on either drilling two holes into the exhaust manifold at the same angle. Said holes will be about 1''. Weld a couple of pieces of DOM tubing slid into the holes. Havent figured out how far yet. Plumb them into a twenty or so gallon tank in the bed. Use a couple of air operated valves as I have alot of these left over these days. What I need from you guys is suggestions on what size charger to spool. All you valve guys what size charger are you trying to spool when pulling with an auto at about 4500rpm?
 
sinfulcoin said:
Alright here is said experiment. My brother bought a '96 2wd auto. I want to hang a big freaking charger on it. I planned on either drilling two holes into the exhaust manifold at the same angle. Said holes will be about 1''. Weld a couple of pieces of DOM tubing slid into the holes. Havent figured out how far yet. Plumb them into a twenty or so gallon tank in the bed. Use a couple of air operated valves as I have alot of these left over these days. What I need from you guys is suggestions on what size charger to spool. All you valve guys what size charger are you trying to spool when pulling with an auto at about 4500rpm?
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I would start with an S480
 
So I am thinking about this will it be able to rev. I know that its going to be smokey before I hit the switch to blast the turbo. Is it going to break up like a mod truck or is that in the timing to turn the revs those guys want? If dragracing could I sit on the line at 4000-4500 just blasting the smoke and then the lights come down and POW the air comes on and the charger comes on like it pi**ed off at life.
 
You know you have ineedahugeturboidas if you're going to do this:p!:hehe:
 
I used to work on Centacs and Cooper/Joy air compressors so you have no idea, if I thought I could run the new TNX122 trust me I would buy it.
 
Hey man no worries, I and others always enjoy when people try something new so long as we can be privy to the findings of their efforts! IMHO that's what these message forums are all about!
 
I wasn't stressing, I love trying out new different things. Only thing with this idea is that even it was the cats azz I think most big pulls won't let you have a compressed tank. I got this idea because I built a kit helicopter and in order to save weight because it takes a rather large battery to start the turbine I coverted it to gas impingment. It has two small jets that the air comes out of that hits the turbine wheel and spools the engine to speed. I thought here it works on this why not on a big freaking turbo. Think of how much bigger of a set of twin's you could run on a truck like BBD if you didn't have to worry about spooling them and it could help you stay under them at the big end. Same thing at the dragstrip any hoo guys might think I am nuts but I am really tired of hearing about the same old charger setups and what not. Thought this might turn som heads and it would be fun to tune on at the same time.
 
sinfulcoin said:
I wasn't stressing, I love trying out new different things. Only thing with this idea is that even it was the cats azz I think most big pulls won't let you have a compressed tank. I got this idea because I built a kit helicopter and in order to save weight because it takes a rather large battery to start the turbine I coverted it to gas impingment. It has two small jets that the air comes out of that hits the turbine wheel and spools the engine to speed. I thought here it works on this why not on a big freaking turbo. Think of how much bigger of a set of twin's you could run on a truck like BBD if you didn't have to worry about spooling them and it could help you stay under them at the big end. Same thing at the dragstrip any hoo guys might think I am nuts but I am really tired of hearing about the same old charger setups and what not. Thought this might turn som heads and it would be fun to tune on at the same time.
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Me too...What about directing the compressed air into the compressor wheel...might be dual purpose
 
I had thought about that and with the math that I am coming up with it seems that a twenty gal tank at 250psi with all 1'' fittings and line is going to be a really good starting point not to mention I have this crap sitting on the self. I am shopping for a turbo right now. Only difference I can come up with is that on my helicopter I use 3000psi reduced to 600psi at the engine. Reason for this is that I can get almost 10-15sec starts. Thats 150 seconds or two and a half mins. Thats alot longer than a sled pull or drag race.
 
dragnsled said:
Me too...What about directing the compressed air into the compressor wheel...might be dual purpose
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Then you have to worry about hitting the wheel with the air at the correct angle. I think that would be a little more difficult then plumbing into the exhaust side and letting the air expansion and direction of flow do the work for you. $.02
 
Why not have a tank that the compressor side of the turbo pumps air into with a one way check valve. Then it will store the air for the turbine side feed thru a electric air solenoid. That way u will always have air. Like a loop system. It would act like you would have a boost leak till the tank got full. But I dont think it would take much air to spool the turbine for starting the sled and the last few feet of a pull.
 
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