Billet Aluminum Cylinder head

Outside of being lighter i'm not sure why anyone would want an aluminum cummins block. Maybe a head but not a block. They are very prone to moving around and I can't imagine what all the cylinder pressures these max effort cummins apps would do to aluminum.

LSM is pretty intellimagent and they produce or atleast machine both alluminum and steel billets.
LSM Systems Engineering | Custom Billet Blocks

If you need it that's where my money would be.

Also note worthy is what was mentioned above; that cummins scrapped the aluminum block program. As of late, when it comes to things like blocks and turbos when a multi-million (or even billion) dollar corporation with R&D departments testing more things than all sponsors on this board combined together times ten scrap a project there might be good reasoning behind it.
 
XLR8R said:
A 4140 chunk that big is terribly expensive.
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If people are crazy enough to even consider $10,000 for one fricken ONE cylinder head i'm sure they can pay for one of these blocks. :bang

Sorry, guess i'm just astounded at the cost of some of the parts for this diesel performance hobby. $10,000 gets you a pair of heads for just about any v8 ported by those working in NHRA pro stock if you knew who to talk to (more than likely i've never made an honest effort to do that myself lmao)!
 
Sure - it just follows the money... stuff we develop that overlaps NASCAR & Top Fuel apps makes 10 large look like a pit pass - teams with good sponsorship spend a lot more than that just figuring out what they want/need.

It's a big help to piggyback off the corporate bucks already spent to get hard parts in hand that will go the distance.
 
Sorry to tell you but aluminum blocks are used in top fuel engines....with cylinder psi (over 100,000psi) that a diesel will NEVER see! 8000hp and over 4000lbs of TQ is only an estimate. Some estimate the #'s even higher!

Aluminum blocks will work just fine, but it all wont be aluminum it cant be, the cylinders are steel sleeved, the lifter are bushed with bronz, copper, or steel. and the blocks are allways girdled with steel plate. Some blocks have bolt in steel mains as well...

Aircraft alumium is "almost" as strong as steel, new heat treatments have advanced far beyond what was availible 10-15 years ago.
 
DIESEL_POWER said:
Sorry to tell you but aluminum blocks are used in top fuel engines....with cylinder psi (over 100,000psi) that a diesel will NEVER see! 8000hp and over 4000lbs of TQ is only an estimate. Some estimate the #'s even higher!

Aluminum blocks will work just fine, but it all wont be aluminum it cant be, the cylinders are steel sleeved, the lifter are bushed with bronz, copper, or steel. and the blocks are allways girdled with steel plate. Some blocks have bolt in steel mains as well...

Aircraft alumium is "almost" as strong as steel, new heat treatments have advanced far beyond what was availible 10-15 years ago.
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Top fuel motors are pulled down after every single pass. I suppose that is ok at the level of diesel motorsports these blocks would be used in? Otherwise i'd stick to steel.
 
NickTF said:
Top fuel motors are pulled down after every single pass. I suppose that is ok at the level of diesel motorsports these blocks would be used in? Otherwise i'd stick to steel.
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Steel is fine too, unless you need the weight reduction, and in drag racing that the only way to be competitive. sled pullers could care less about weight.
 
DIESEL_POWER said:
....with cylinder psi (over 100,000psi) that a diesel will NEVER see!
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Guess your finger got stuck on the zero key - turbodiesels generate up to ~200bar (2900psi)... TF mills grenade long before 100Kpsi just from hydro-locking.
 
XLR8R said:
Guess your finger got stuck on the zero key - turbodiesels generate up to ~200bar (2900psi)... TF mills grenade long before 100Kpsi just from hydro-locking.
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Yes my figer hit one too manny zero's but you get the point.

Also the diesel will make way more than 2900psi, i know this for fact... accually i have seen about 5000psi in some tractor engines.

pro stock engines run between 3500-4000psi on avg
top fuel can be as high as 16000+psi
 
NickTF said:
Top fuel motors are pulled down after every single pass. I suppose that is ok at the level of diesel motorsports these blocks would be used in? Otherwise i'd stick to steel.
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Do they replace the block after every pass....
 
DIESEL_POWER said:
Yes my figer hit one too manny zero's but you get the point.
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Just keeping it accurate! (and ~2900psi is max for OEM turbodiesels)

... dang keyboard - seems that manny stole an N from your figer...
 
I thought the Aluminum Block's from Cummins where steel sleved and it wasn't the Block they where having problem's with. Something along the lines of sealing issues.
 
this thread brings out the old saying.... Speed costs money, how fast do you want to go.
 
Lostnwalmart said:
Do they replace the block after every pass....
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If it doesn't check out i'm quite sure they do. The point is bringing up an example of top fuel, a motor which everything is completely torn down and checked after EVERY PASS INCLUDING THE BLOCK, is a poor example of longevity of an aluminum block for the average Joe. Like the gentlemen and I agreed on earlier, they have their place but for most these trucks isn't one of them. Max effort tractor pull doesn't need the weight reduction especially over the front and drag race guys are already racing at heavy weights dropping 400lbs in a 6500lb or thereabout vehicle is not nearly like dropping 400lbs out of a 3000lb vehicle. If you want to run one by all means.$.02

I had a darton wet sleeved ls1 block. I have an idea of what i'm talking about.
 
The pictures of the ports I posted were of a Cosworth engine, not diesel related. I'll start a different thread about billets heads.
 
DIESEL_POWER said:
Aircraft alumium is "almost" as strong as steel, new heat treatments have advanced far beyond what was availible 10-15 years ago.
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Be careful here. Strength and stiffness are very different things and a lot of people confuse the two.

While you can find Al alloys with very high yield strengths, they will also have ~2-3X the strain (elongation) while doing so compared to steel. However, they do have similar elastic properties to that of plain jane cast irons. Ductile iron almost doubles the modulus.

Unless one adds something like a silicon carbide fiber, the elastic modulus of almost all the Al alloys are about the same, it doesn't matter how you heat treat it. There is no magic to be had there.

So, if you want an aluminum block to compare to a plain cast iron block, you'd use similar dimensions and reap the benefit of weight savings.

If you want something in Al to compare to a 4340 billet block, it would need to be so thick that it might not be worth it because much of the weight savings is lost.
 
nwpadmax said:
Be careful here. Strength and stiffness are very different things and a lot of people confuse the two.

While you can find Al alloys with very high yield strengths, they will also have ~2-3X the strain (elongation) while doing so compared to steel. However, they do have similar elastic properties to that of plain jane cast irons. Ductile iron almost doubles the modulus.

Unless one adds something like a silicon carbide fiber, the elastic modulus of almost all the Al alloys are about the same, it doesn't matter how you heat treat it. There is no magic to be had there.

So, if you want an aluminum block to compare to a plain cast iron block, you'd use similar dimensions and reap the benefit of weight savings.

If you want something in Al to compare to a 4340 billet block, it would need to be so thick that it might not be worth it because much of the weight savings is lost.
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Agreed!
 
Also, we must not forget that the properties of all aluminum alloys drop rapidly with increasing temperature...so if we're using it, better keep it heavily water cooled, or limit the duration of exposure, use coatings, etc.
 
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