Bosch H Series Inline Pump Dynamic Timing

newsmoke said:
Would it be possible to adapt the pump harness to a vp motor and have the factory ecu control it?
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No, the cummins ECM runs a data bus to the vp44 with desired fuel rate etc and this pump simply has voice coil servo actuators (position is dictated by pwm duty cycle) for the fuel rack and the timing rack.
 
newsmoke said:
Well damn. I wish I knew as much about electronics as you guys do.
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I actually just troubleshot and replaced an ECM on a 24V the day before, so that is still somewhat fresh in mind. Lol





madmikeismad said:
Another reason I like ppumps. Even the solenoid can be negated.
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Fortunately the electronics here are *much* simpler than dodge setups. No data buses or multiple modules here. Lol
 
YOUNG GUNS15 said:
Caterpillar used a pump gear to advance timing. If it could be packaged into our pump gears that'd be pretty awesome.

2010-07-01_044736_Timing_advance.jpg


I think this is different from caterpillars...

edit: duh, says bosch right on it.

Automatic-Timing-Advance.jpg
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Do you have a part number for this part?
 
Small developments-
Discovered a way to stabilize the vanes and still provide quick response, something I have been struggling with on the current vgt program for some time now.
Looking to do a dmax chra with the Ford shaft and housings so I can water cool the turbo and have a provision for vane position feedback. Also looking at cerakoting the components for further egt protection.
 
More small developments- deciphered the method used in the original vgt program to convert raw data into units, for example my pressure request map now uses psia instead of bar for the drive pressure sensor. This lays the foundation for the h pump ecm, because we're going to use a lot of different units to control smoke and achieve maximum efficiency with the vgt system. G/sec for mass airflow, psia for boost and drive pressures, mm3 for fuel rate, degrees rankine and Fahrenheit for egt points, compressor inlet temp, and manifold air temp- just to name a few.

Ran into some wiring issues that need to be fixed, tps bounces all over the place and lacks any consistency. I got a hold of a bunch of twisted shielded 4 conductor wire, so soon I'll be tackling that.

As for the project, it's going to be done in stages, starting with the h pump, probably a cam, and the 6.0 turbo with external gate, and air to water intercooler placed atop the valve covers. The engine will be mounted good and low enough in my Chevrolet to fit a decent size cooler, and with the core support it will be much easier overall to stick with the huge stock 454/6.5 radiator and ac condenser and keep all that stock, as reliability or core support components has been an issue. If things go well ill later add in the 80mm primary vgt, ported and polished + oringed head. Considering a interstage air to water cooler between the two turbos for maximum efficiency for the amount of boost ill be running, especially after calculations show 8-900* compressor discharge temp with the twin turbos pushing 85 psi of boost.
 
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Update...
Things have been kinda slow lately, lots of stuff going on at home, I'm actually about to welcome my firstborn son to the world in less than 2 weeks from today.

I'm running through defining all my variables that I'm going to use and I actually produced the first snippet of code tonight, designed to set pressure ratio limits based on mass air flow to prevent low end surging, and also to define maximum limits to prevent overspeed.

The programming side is really starting to come together, I'm pretty excited.

As for the current VGT program running the 6.0 turbo- I finally got all the issues hammered out. All my signals are stable, the tuning has its... limitations, that will be hammered out in the h-pump ecm release. I'm going to be using an entirely different strategy to control the twin VGT setup, still set on the stock 6.0L turbo externally wastegated into a he551v with a GTX4508 80mm billet compressor wheel. Preliminary chartings on the compressor maps show as much as 20 lb/min of flow as early as 1400, up to 120 lb/min at 3500 rpm. Hoping those translate into real world results.
 
On an additional note, here's my parts list so far for the rebuild:
5x.016 Injectors (still haven't decided who to get them from yet)
024 Delivery valves
Hamilton 188-208 cam
Mild head port with bowl work and possibly valve grind
o-rings
arp 625's
Custom exhaust manifold
6.0L VGT Secondary, external gate
he551v Primary w 80mm GTX4508 billet compressor
fluidampr
main studs
Waterman fuel pump with post injection pump pressure regulation
Billet gear case + cover
FrozenBoost type 52 150psi a/w intercooler (on separate coolant plumbing)
454/6.5 stock radiator
rear freeze plug bypass
Evans waterless coolant
Mechanical based fan, if possible. Thinking about vistronic.
Eaton EasyPedal double disc clutch, factory rated 1400 lbf ft.

Thoughts?
 
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I've been watching this one for a while....

just curious, with all the other technology on the truck, why the mechanical fan/clutch? Why not go to a Horton clutch, or something similar that is electronically actuated?



edit: nevermind, I just read what a vistronic fan is...carry on.....:)
 
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4thesporty said:
I've been watching this one for a while....

just curious, with all the other technology on the truck, why the mechanical fan/clutch? Why not go to a Horton clutch, or something similar that is electronically actuated?



edit: nevermind, I just read what a vistronic fan is...carry on.....:)
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Horton clutch? What's that, a type of vistronic or something totally different?

The idea is, I'm going to try the 'run the engine slightly hotter' concept with the Evans coolant.
 
Looks like I'm gonna be going with A1 H11 studs instead of arp's, managed to score a deal on supposedly new in bag studs.

Plus my head gasket's slowly dying. Wooooohoo.

Ditching the mechanical fan idea with a viscuous clutch anyway, I'll probably either go electric or air clutch (since I'll need onboard air for the holset VGT anyway).
 
Update- I know, it's been a long while. Been busy with life. Things are slowly starting to move forward again. Here's the latest:

I have discovered that the 6.0 vgt turbo I've been running for the last 2 years has a max housing size of around 15cm. This explains why I was thinking I'd need an external gate. That said, for the compound vgt setup I will definitely be looking into using a he351ve as tuning will be much easier with just twins and no external gate. However, I have conceptualized an electro hydraulic actuator apparatus that will essentially allow me to control the vanes with a pwm signal as opposed to trying to use canbus. This actuator will perform the same way that mechanism in a 6.0 turbo does, and the control valve will actually come from the 6.0 turbo.

I have made extremely significant progress in programming the controller, mainly coming up with a GOOD strategy for controlling the vanes. So now that I know how to programming works, controlling the h pump should be relatively easy.

There are several things that are going to happen with this truck while the h pump swap goes on.
We're looking at putting the engine in a crew cab short bed Chevrolet (current truck is a 93 CCLB Chevrolet) of the same vintage. While I'm extremely confident that the 6 speed Eaton manual transmission will hold the horsepower I plan on running, the swap would be greatly simplified by running a built 48re. I believe the 06+ 5.9 trucks with the 48re had fully electronic valve bodies and this is what I am after as I plan on fully integrating shift point control with the engine controller. There will be 4 modes available for selection, one for towing, one for dd/street, one for economy, and one for the drag strip. Fueling, spooling, and shift points will all have their variances.

Thoughts and suggestions welcome!
 
Awesome build! Subbed. It's great to see how you can make so many different parts work together
 
ShadowTrooper said:
Update- I know, it's been a long while. Been busy with life. Things are slowly starting to move forward again. Here's the latest:

I have discovered that the 6.0 vgt turbo I've been running for the last 2 years has a max housing size of around 15cm. This explains why I was thinking I'd need an external gate. That said, for the compound vgt setup I will definitely be looking into using a he351ve as tuning will be much easier with just twins and no external gate. However, I have conceptualized an electro hydraulic actuator apparatus that will essentially allow me to control the vanes with a pwm signal as opposed to trying to use canbus. This actuator will perform the same way that mechanism in a 6.0 turbo does, and the control valve will actually come from the 6.0 turbo.

I have made extremely significant progress in programming the controller, mainly coming up with a GOOD strategy for controlling the vanes. So now that I know how to programming works, controlling the h pump should be relatively easy.

There are several things that are going to happen with this truck while the h pump swap goes on.
We're looking at putting the engine in a crew cab short bed Chevrolet (current truck is a 93 CCLB Chevrolet) of the same vintage. While I'm extremely confident that the 6 speed Eaton manual transmission will hold the horsepower I plan on running, the swap would be greatly simplified by running a built 48re. I believe the 06+ 5.9 trucks with the 48re had fully electronic valve bodies and this is what I am after as I plan on fully integrating shift point control with the engine controller. There will be 4 modes available for selection, one for towing, one for dd/street, one for economy, and one for the drag strip. Fueling, spooling, and shift points will all have their variances.

Thoughts and suggestions welcome!
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Glad you are still working on this. Sorry for becoming a ghost. Life gets really busy sometimes...

The 48re should be the same setup as a 47re but with an electronic version of the TV. You're WOT shifts will still be based on springs, and your lock up will be based on the valves, but I think you should be able to control shift points electronically. You could probably even make a paddle shifter setup if you found the sweet spots and controlled the rpm/speed inputs too. I am currently working on that for my AW4 in my XJ (much easier since solenoids completely control gear selection).

Keep up the good work bud!
 
Without flipping through this whole thread, is it a Mack E7 pump? Quick glance it sort of looked like it...
 
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