it's scary what can be found in an ECM

Cummin-a-long said:
Oh, I know....tragic.

There's one more screen name I'm waiting to see pop up without anything constructive.
Click to expand...

Yippie kay yay.


Die Hard over here done gotz the world of CompD and diesels in general figured out. Following in the early footsteps of some greats. Only a select few still like them. It's a shame because they actually were intelligent people, just went around it the wrong way. You should stick to your pretty pictures.
 
TheBigNasty said:
Yippie kay yay.

Die Hard over here done gotz the world of CompD and diesels in general figured out. Following in the early footsteps of some greats. Only a select few still like them. It's a shame because they actually were intelligent people, just went around it the wrong way. You should stick to your pretty pictures.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I'll take that under consideration. You should stick to plug and play.

It's always funny to see who pokes their head up when the only thing left to do is talk ish. You're always sure to be there, I'm just waiting to see your buddy pop up.

Predictable.....very, very predictable.
 
Well what can I say, I'm left to default when I try to make constructive conversation and am met with hostility.
 
TheBigNasty said:
1. I was asking in reference to your original unedited post, why neutral brings about a zeroed out condition.

2. Pull the stick out of your ass. Just because you think you know all there is to it, doesn't mean you need to be a dick.

3. Triton, put the pom pom's down for awhile, it's getting old.
Click to expand...

Hmmm....constructive converstaion.....you should roll with that thought.

Keep in mind, all I asked you was....

Tell ME what YOU see....

What happens in this tune when you come FULLY off the throttle?

Remember, we were commanding 36k psi (limited to 23.2K)....look at the duration values on the thottle vs OFF the throttle. What's the problem there?
Click to expand...

So...hostile? No. I just reciprocate the attitude given.

You just got mad because you got put on the spot.
 
Ok chief. Put me on the spot so I responded with hostility. I just was stating how sad it was watching you try to be cute with your pictures.
 
TheBigNasty said:
Ok chief. Put me on the spot so I responded with hostility. I just was stating how sad it was watching you try to be cute with your pictures.
Click to expand...

You asked the question, you were fed a scenario and you wanted to put me on the spot....I just called your bluff and flipped the script on ya.

I couldn't care less what you think of a picture. Whats sad is watching folks who are better at being smart asses than anything else chit up threads.....and KNOWING that they'll pop up.

Like I said, predictable.

If your idea of a productive existance is to poke in and stir the pot, ya might wanna do it with someone who doesn't do it back. I don't give a rats about hurting someones feelings and I'll gladly pull up that little vail of BS.

Unlike you, my intent is ALWAYS to assist. Your intent is to run around the playground like the little kid with no manners.
 
Well.....I'm over it....maybe its my backing with a stand alone, using calibrated injectors knowing exactly what they flow and seeing everything on the screen in real time has me jaded.

EFI is such an awesome tool, I see no reason why you would not calibrate with it the same way as a stand alone, however can respect if you have 50 guys knocking on your door your attempt to simplify the tune.

AND can do so without the full hardware understanding of the system.



The attitude is bull chit though, Not going to help business at all.



With that I'll give credit were it's due......

This post


Cummin-a-long said:
[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]If you just start with it and you really don't know the values and what will make the truck run, you really have to data log it....or do a SH!T ton of math to figure out what you need.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]One thing you can do is use the custom mapping feature and see what the truck is ACTUALLY doing and you can start from there.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
Slide18.jpg
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Once you have the values that make the truck at least idle correctly, you can start applying your values to achieve the end goal.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]What I do is I pick specific points on the maps and I apply the target value that I want at that point, then I build the tune around those points, because I'll tell ya flat out that if you use the OEM maps, a full 1/3 of it will never be used because it's not in any real world range that will actually be applied.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT][FONT=&quot]Once you tune a crap load of trucks, you have tunes that are a CLOSE fit and then all you're doing is fine tuning it for THAT specific owners wants.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]If he wants it totally clean and not a lick of smoke, you go in one direction. If he wants a light haze so it's a slight over fuel condition, you go another way. If he wants enough fuel to spray the crap out of the truck, you do something else.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]
BUT, if the truck is properly fueled and has the correct airflow, the tables will actually be pretty similar.[/FONT]
Click to expand...



Right on the money,

For those starting out, data logging and watching the process before you modify anything is a powerful tool.

FRANKLY its a crime just how cheap EFI sells this for.....

Go ahead, start a new thread and put a clinic on how you do it.......answer the folks questions without the attitude...... I'll keep out of it as it drives me insane......LOL. If you just seen once how everything just comes together with a calibrated injector table you would never go back.


Not sure knocking box tuner tunes is necessarily productive either.....We all know their issues.
 
Last edited:
Joesixpack said:
Your right......LOL.....THATS WHAT TUNERS DO correct the calibration.....LOL :nail: At least the ones who know what their doing......LOL
Click to expand...

What a novel concept. Correct the calibration instead of treating it as a pile of references. Its amazing how much more intuitive reading and modifying a tune can be when the data is treated as information and not just some randomly generated reference.
 
Trust me, my intent is never a pissing contest.

I'm more than happy to listen, learn and help out where it's needed.

If your first post in here was the one with all the calculations, I wouldn't have taken an ounce of offense....not in the least. I would have be more than happy to see what you have to do with the standalone. But, when it's stuff like, OH GAWD....yeah, puts me in another mood entirely.

We were both talking about the same thing....just using different methods for the application. In EFILive, I can set the mm3 value at anything I want and it has no ill effects if the rest of axis' are done the same. Does it hurt it to put in the injectors calibrations....no, not if you have them. If it's one tune for one truck, why not. I can't do that with pressure or duration, it F's up the whole tune. IF your standalone needs that data, cool. I'd like to see how it uses it.

But, when those of us have to beta these things, it helps when every one is on close to the same sheet of music. One can go, "Hey, I'm only seeing 100m3 in the log". If that's a commonly used variable, we're all looking for the same thing. But if one is scaled from 0 - 100, another at 0 - 400, etc.....the corrections have no meaning.
 
Last edited:
HotRodTractor said:
What a novel concept. Correct the calibration instead of treating it as a pile of references. Its amazing how much more intuitive reading and modifying a tune can be when the data is treated as information and not just some randomly generated reference.
Click to expand...


Yeah....it's a tough concept.....Even pullers with 12valvers can tell you what their pumps and injectors flow......well if they will part with such information......

Always chuckled when I seen dmax guys saying well I'm at 3000us and 24000psi......And no inkling of what they are flowing.......now it's crossing over to the Cummins.......DAMNIT.
 
Last edited:
Joesixpack said:
Yeah....it's a tough concept.....Even pullers with 12valvers can tell you what their pumps and injectors flow......well if they will part with such information......

Always chuckled when I seen dmax guys saying well I'm at 3000us and 24000psi......And no inkling of what they are flowing.......now it's crossing over to the Cummins.......DAMNIT.
Click to expand...

I'm a 7.3 Ford guy and even I know what my sticks flow! LOL

 
You should see what these hogs flow in less than half the time!!! Totally forgot about the Ford guys, have never seen any of the tuning end of it. 6.4 guys can lay it down with a tuner and a butload of NAWZ....
 
Last edited:
Joesixpack said:
You should see what these hogs flow in less than half the time!!! Totally forgot about the Ford guys, have never seen any of the tuning end of it. 6.4 guys can lay it down with a tuner and a butload of NAWZ....
Click to expand...

No doubt - the graph I posted is exactly why a 7.3 PSD is at the power levels they are at. Injection rate, injection rate, injection rate. That graph represents the "typical" race injector that you would find in the top trucks. I've had some stuff up my sleeve for a while that more than doubles what you see in that graph.... but that's another thread.
 
HotRodTractor said:
No doubt - the graph I posted is exactly why a 7.3 PSD is at the power levels they are at. Injection rate, injection rate, injection rate. That graph represents the "typical" race injector that you would find in the top trucks. I've had some stuff up my sleeve for a while that more than doubles what you see in that graph.... but that's another thread.
Click to expand...

Absolutley.....the injection rate of the huei injection system has been far from desirable. I've heard of a couple shops really bringing them along.
Used to keep an eye on Charles progress with his 7.3.....poor bastard still at ~700......for a guy that smart it just isn't coming together.
 
Last edited:
Joesixpack said:
Yeah....it's a tough concept.....Even pullers with 12valvers can tell you what their pumps and injectors flow......well if they will part with such information......

Always chuckled when I seen dmax guys saying well I'm at 3000us and 24000psi......And no inkling of what they are flowing.......now it's crossing over to the Cummins.......DAMNIT.
Click to expand...

Yeah.

As a side note. I must say, thanks to all that participated in this thread! I learned something today!
1) never look at a coloring book to build tunes
2) never go against your gut feeling if your p7100 tuning background tells you differently
 
Last edited:
Wow......Ive tuned duramaxes for some time, and i have to say it is absolutely hilarious to watch you cummins guys learn to use EFILive. I have to say tho.. I believe that Rich has the best idea of how the system operates. MM3 of fuel is probably calculated close from the factory, But really it is only a reference.
 
GADieselGTO said:
Wow......Ive tuned duramaxes for some time, and i have to say it is absolutely hilarious to watch you cummins guys learn to use EFILive. I have to say tho.. I believe that Rich has the best idea of how the system operates. MM3 of fuel is probably calculated close from the factory, But really it is only a reference.
Click to expand...

If you take the approach that mm3 is actual and start by correcting it then the rest of the tuning process is simple. Carry on with the smoke and mirror theory if you wish, its amusing!
 
Joesixpack said:
You should see what these hogs flow in less than half the time!!! Totally forgot about the Ford guys, have never seen any of the tuning end of it. 6.4 guys can lay it down with a tuner and a butload of NAWZ....
Click to expand...
Quit teasing me like that. LOL
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top