My cam looks like ch!t!!!!! Why??

N

nrussell

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Apr 23, 2008
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I pulled my Helix2 out today because I'm swapping it into my new rebuild and it looks like hell. Only the lobes not the journals. The sad part is it only had about 8k miles on it. What do you guys think went wrong?
 
Bad oil? Inproper break in procedure? Could be a lot of things...
 
My Spartan Billet cam was starting to show some problems on one of the lobes. I always use zinc additive when I change oil and add additional zinc at 1k miles( I change oil every 2-3k miles). I had to have it and the lifters changed. Only had 8-10k miles on it. My helix 2 looked great after a couple of years, so i was hoping the Spartan would hold up well.
 
maybe one of your jornals for oil in the engine is plugged and it is running dry
 
The pressure exceeded the surface area the oil film had to work with. This is a problem ALL cam manufacturers, regrinders etc. have to fight. There is an old thread about an 04.5 cam compared to a helix. Regardless of any technical jargan put out there by manufacturers, there is no way around the issue except wider lobes. Zinc seems to help a great deal in some instances while not much in others. I have seen it happen with lighter springs or heavier springs. If there was a major oiling issue, you would see it on the journals as well as the lobes and in other parts of the engine.

Most likely your tappets are fine. If this is the case, then what you are seeing is a hydraulic errosion that should be most evident on the edge of the lobe and on the nose. Another thing that helps prevent this is a radiused edge to the lobe. Does your helix have this?

Zach
 
Ck this out

ZDDPlus Classic Car Engine Oil Additive - Flat-tappet and high-performance engines - Zind and Phosphorous oil additive


I've had the following: one oem cam; an aftermaket; an aftermarket; and oem cam and an aftemarket cam. If what you are describing looks like the very top surface of the cam lobe is pealing or appears to be pealing then that is called spalling. You can google that to see the scientific definition.

I went to the ZDDP product following my 1st two aftermarket cams which are popular on this site. I don't think it really had anything to do with the cams but rather the huge increase of power/heat etc and the oils were NOT keeping up with the need. Since I added the additive of ZDDP the last two have shown any spallng affect. This stuff is not cheap, but it has worked for ME.
 
OT-OF-Here said:
ZDDPlus Classic Car Engine Oil Additive - Flat-tappet and high-performance engines - Zind and Phosphorous oil additive


I've had the following: one oem cam; an aftermaket; an aftermarket; and oem cam and an aftemarket cam. If what you are describing looks like the very top surface of the cam lobe is pealing or appears to be pealing then that is called spalling. You can google that to see the scientific definition.

I went to the ZDDP product following my 1st two aftermarket cams which are popular on this site. I don't think it really had anything to do with the cams but rather the huge increase of power/heat etc and the oils were NOT keeping up with the need. Since I added the additive of ZDDP the last two have shown any spallng affect. This stuff is not cheap, but it has worked for ME.
Click to expand...
So are you supposed to add 3 bottles to every oil change?
 
nrussell said:
I pulled my Helix2 out today because I'm swapping it into my new rebuild and it looks like hell. Only the lobes not the journals. The sad part is it only had about 8k miles on it. What do you guys think went wrong?
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What valve springs and what oil were you using?

Paul
 
nrussell said:
rotella t
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:badidea:

See what happened was, that when all the new trucks required new emission standards, the oil needed to be changed to a CJ rating.. Unfortunately the CJ rating removed more than half of the sulfated ash content, and quite a bit of the zinc as well.. what this leaves us with is junk.. an oil with no ability to neutralize combustion chemicals and poor load bearing and sheer qualities.. Find a CI or lower rated oil and buy it and use it.. add a bottle of zinc every oil change. if you can find it use Lucas 15w-40 high TBN oil, it is CI rated and has high total base number.. rotella has been proven to cause ISB rocker shaft scuffing in an industrial application, never mind a performance application..$.02
 
I have a helix cam, and used the ZDDP, with the first few changes, and from thin on I have been using the Lucas zink additive with every change. Tho with a couple injector problems and just sheer nervousness I change it ALOT!!!
 
ive used rotella T in about every oil change in my 12 valve.

In fact we use rotella in abouth everything we own. untill i get the money to do a cam, i wont know the condition of my cam......
 
YOUNG GUNS15 said:
ive used rotella T in about every oil change in my 12 valve.

In fact we use rotella in abouth everything we own. untill i get the money to do a cam, i wont know the condition of my cam......
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Rotella was a good oil, probably the best for the money, but now, oil is oil.. if you run it in equipment i think that it will be fine. the differences in tolerances and load bearing area form a 5.9 to a 8.3 or bigger engine is pretty sufficient to allow for some lubrication deficiency.. the 5.9 is pretty light duty for a cummins.. and the way the oiling system is designed on the engine, it relies heavily on oil..
 
YOUNG GUNS15 said:
ive used rotella T in about every oil change in my 12 valve.

In fact we use rotella in abouth everything we own. untill i get the money to do a cam, i wont know the condition of my cam......
Click to expand...

I'm in the same boat. I used to run conventional, then I went to school in Laramie, WY and the -10 or colder start ups I decided to switch to Rotella 5w-40 although I run their 15w-40 now.
 
XTrEmE9156 said:
Rotella was a good oil, probably the best for the money, but now, oil is oil.. if you run it in equipment i think that it will be fine. the differences in tolerances and load bearing area form a 5.9 to a 8.3 or bigger engine is pretty sufficient to allow for some lubrication deficiency.. the 5.9 is pretty light duty for a cummins.. and the way the oiling system is designed on the engine, it relies heavily on oil..
Click to expand...


yeah, our 14L cummins big cam 2 has over 11000 hours on it and it runs perfect.

so what oil do you run? this has got me worried a little since my valves were out a fair bit at only 10k since the last job.
 
YOUNG GUNS15 said:
yeah, our 14L cummins big cam 2 has over 11000 hours on it and it runs perfect.

so what oil do you run? this has got me worried a little since my valves were out a fair bit at only 10k since the last job.
Click to expand...

pretty much anything with a CI or lower rating.. currently i run either lucas 15w-40 high TBN which is comparably priced to Valvoline premium blue or i use Super S 15w-40 which is a CH, CI.. i use a full bottle of lucas break in additive for safe measure.. You don't need to run a full bottle, but i do anyway.. :D
 
The reason I use 2 bottles is:

OT-OF-Here said:
I use two bottles per change.
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It says to use 1 bottle to 5 qts. With the 12 qts we have then I use two bottles, as the Rotella T (yes, I use it too) has a pretty good safegard of zinc in it vs a lot of other oils. It also says to use ALL in the bottle once you open so you'd have a partial bottle left out of a third bottle so I feel (and my actual eyes on inspection shows) that the two bottles with the Rotella are doing the trick for me. My $.02
 
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