Swole...Again!

Big Swole said:
WILD Shot in the dark here!!! And NOT trying to say anything here, just asking.....


Right after my tip spit and it went back together is when I installed the REV-X stuff....

Since the motor may or may not have been fully broken in, Is the ANY way that the super slick RevX had anything to do with this??
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Sorry to hear this again man! that sucks.

If this is a concern, call dan. he went to hooters and cowboys with us after PRI and is a damn good guy. i think he would be more than happy to let you throw some concerns his way.

As far as ring gap, i saw a set of rings much like these http://image.hotrod.com/f/techarticles/9257243+w200/p106481_image_large.jpg in the Mahle booth at PRI. i think theyre a zero gap (i could be wrong) maybe those would be the way to go?
 
Just a guess, but..........

Do you know which cylinder split the tip? I am betting that cylinder has a broken top ring. But like I said, just a guess.
 
Joesixpack said:
Those specs are wrong BTW....LOL I mean if your going to post specs might as well get them right,

Factory specs,
Top ring, min .011 max .023
second ring min .035 max .054
Oil min .011 max .030

Now thats factory, on a HOT build you'd likely open it up a bit.....YET I've pulled one apart that was a bottle baby at .014 and it was living just fine, don't recommend it but it did.


On the nozzle DAMN....
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Thanks for the update...I knew they were off and was gonna post the correct ones in the morning but you beat me to it. I posted backwards too!!!!


Dam Swole......look at what your threads do to us!!!!!LOLLOLLOL
 
Point is Swole stop working on it and stop letting other people give you advice. Send the damn thing out to a good shop and get it built. Or continue down your path of destruction. I haven't been through as many as you. I gave up after the third yes Swole I kept up on your builds. This last CR I had I was just about to start the build until you had problems AGAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!! I gave up cause I wasn't going to risk it. It's obvious whatever your doing isn't right. Get it out or get rid of it.
 
blownsmokestrok said:
Sorry to hear this again man! that sucks.

If this is a concern, call dan. he went to hooters and cowboys with us after PRI and is a damn good guy. i think he would be more than happy to let you throw some concerns his way.

As far as ring gap, i saw a set of rings much like these http://image.hotrod.com/f/techarticles/9257243+w200/p106481_image_large.jpg in the Mahle booth at PRI. i think theyre a zero gap (i could be wrong) maybe those would be the way to go?
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I'll ask about those rings!! Thanks for posting!

I'm doubting the RevX had anything to do with it.. But I may ask him anyway just to see his thoughts!!

matty169 said:
Do you know which cylinder split the tip? I am betting that cylinder has a broken top ring. But like I said, just a guess.
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I can't remember which it was cause when I pulled them all out, the split could not be seen by the naked eye... Only until we put them all in the tester did we find the one that was split...

Like the dumba$$ I am, I had my serial number wrote down and which hole they were in, but forget to check before I changed the tips out...

raychem said:
Thanks for the update...I knew they were off and was gonna post the correct ones in the morning but you beat me to it. I posted backwards too!!!!


Dam Swole......look at what your threads do to us!!!!!LOLLOLLOL
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Yup!! My threads do seem cause some major debates and brain storming.... Like Chris (joesixpack) said earlier, My threads usualy end up being educational in some fassion or another....lol
 
Chris... I was looking over your Old Monotherm thread and the oiling hole mod..

Mahle monotherm/Woodruff billet rod combo's alive and well. - Competition Diesel.Com - Bringing The BEST Together


I may look into trying to do this with mine while they are out!
Where do I start?
How do I get the galley ring loose? Just grind the weld?
Then just have the hole drilled in the under skirt? Obviously making sure the squirter bend is correct and lined up?
Then just having the gallery ring tacted back in place lined up with the hole?

Shed some light when you can and if you think I should try this...

Thanks for all the help Buddy!
 
I am sorry for your destruction again David.

Not saying Jeff is at fault but come on you need to wrapped in caution tape. LOL
Brandon
 
Big Swole said:
Chris... I was looking over your Old Monotherm thread and the oiling hole mod..

Mahle monotherm/Woodruff billet rod combo's alive and well. - Competition Diesel.Com - Bringing The BEST Together


I may look into trying to do this with mine while they are out!
Where do I start?
How do I get the galley ring loose? Just grind the weld?
Then just have the hole drilled in the under skirt? Obviously making sure the squirter bend is correct and lined up?
Then just having the gallery ring tacted back in place lined up with the hole?

Shed some light when you can and if you think I should try this...

Thanks for all the help Buddy!
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Its as easy as that, that galley ring originally isn't welded, you have to fool around a bit, but they just pop out.

Its a little bit work with the piston in the block and tweeking the cooling nozzle so it points exactly were it will shoot through the skirt and the new position of the galley hole.

Then mark the piston were you will drill it. A drill press works fine, begin from a small bit, as it seems to me there is a bit of a slope there.

Mark a piston while they are still in the block when you are taking it apart.

Drill the hole, and if you just press down on the tin galley covers with the bit not turning they kinda "pop" out of the holders.

Grind the key off the tins, and reposition, tig weld in place....just a little spot is all they need so they can't rotate.

You will need to tweak each j-jet a little to aim just right, so its spraying through the skirt to the cooling galley when the piston is at bottom stroke, and mid way and up, its spraying the pin.
 
Big Swole said:
HA!! That's for dang sure!! I make a GREAT Test subject!!

But funny thing is, My Garmon (standard size Billet tranny) has lasted through 4 engine builds!!! :rockwoot:

I don't seem to ever have tranny problems.. a testament to Garmon for sure..as well as the Opie shafts...
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That should be a selling point for anyone confused as to what transmission builder to go with. Because all 4 of those engines went through hell with you pushing them.*bdh*LOL
 
:doh:That is a good Idea coming from a guy that gave up!
 
Here are the ring end gap spec's out of the Dodge 05 service manual:

PISTON RINGS DESCRIPTION SPECIFICATION
Metric Standard Ring Gap
Top Ring 0.26 - 0.36mm 0.010 - 0.014 in.
Intermediate 0.85 - 1.15 mm 0.033 - 0.045in.
Oil Control 0.25 - 0.55 mm 0.010 - 0.21 in.

These specs are for STOCK pistons, and STOCK hp. Not to mention they probably didn't have drag racing in mind.

On my 05, I set the top ring to .021in., Intermediate to .035, and oil control to .012. I would not recommend that wide of top ring gap unless you spend a lot of time at the drag strip. This wide of a gap will have some leakage until the engine gets up to temp, and you get some heat on the piston. The intermediate ring gap is already pretty large, and I have not had a problem using the stock spec on it. The only reason for going larger on the Oil control would be if you want to reduce ring tension, to reduce drag. The Mahle's maybe completely different though...

It will be interesting what you find when you pull the engine apart. Sorry this happened to you, you've done your share of R & D ( Rebuild and Destruction :)). Sometimes finding what does work, requires finding what doesn't work first.

Paul
 
paulb said:
Here are the ring end gap spec's out of the Dodge 05 service manual:

PISTON RINGS DESCRIPTION SPECIFICATION
Metric Standard Ring Gap
Top Ring 0.26 - 0.36mm 0.010 - 0.014 in.
Intermediate 0.85 - 1.15 mm 0.033 - 0.045in.
Oil Control 0.25 - 0.55 mm 0.010 - 0.21 in.

These specs are for STOCK pistons, and STOCK hp. Not to mention they probably didn't have drag racing in mind.

On my 05, I set the top ring to .021in., Intermediate to .035, and oil control to .012. I would not recommend that wide of top ring gap unless you spend a lot of time at the drag strip. This wide of a gap will have some leakage until the engine gets up to temp, and you get some heat on the piston. The intermediate ring gap is already pretty large, and I have not had a problem using the stock spec on it. The only reason for going larger on the Oil control would be if you want to reduce ring tension, to reduce drag. The Mahle's maybe completely different though...

It will be interesting what you find when you pull the engine apart. Sorry this happened to you, you've done your share of R & D ( Rebuild and Destruction :)). Sometimes finding what does work, requires finding what doesn't work first.

Paul
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Thank you Paul very much for that info!! I just recieved an email from Eric at Mahle with my ring package specs and a few other details... I'll post them shortly...

Thanks again for the info..Awesome post!

SPEEDSHIFT said:
When are you going to tear it down David?
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Well, I'm having trouble getting it down there today for lack of a ride back home... May have to wait until Monday / Tues to get it down there.

Besides they have to get another engine build completed to clear that bay for me..

Hopefully by New year or so...But I know Jeff is taking a trip after Christmas for a bit... I'm at his mercy at this point but it't totally worth it with they way he is willing to help me!!

I promise I'll keep this thread posted with every detail ( that I'm allowed to share ) just as soon as I have it...
 
Chris (joesixpack).. Here is the specs on your vs. mine

You were talking about the differences in distance of the top ring to the crown.

Heres yours.



12mm (0.472")

Stock is Only 8mm


The ring package you received was Stock Cummins PN's. That was only thing availible at the time.

6ab6e727.jpg


aee631d2.jpg







Mine is :

10mm (0.394")

Stock is 8mm


e59c329b.jpg








The ring package that came with my Monotherms were set to be as follows:

Top = 0.011-0.022"
2nd = 0.035-0.043"
Oil = 0.011-0.022"





Eric Says regardless of the 10mm vs 12mm with the mono's, He would not change his/their recommendations for the gaps posted above..


Evidently, For every 0.001" oversize from stock bore (4.0157"), the ring gap open up by 0.0035".


Eric does not seem to think the Gap of my ring package will have been the problem.. I will be documenting all the parts coming out and may even said him the whole set of piston's / Rings at his request to see the affects on everything...If time allows...
 
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