"The 2.6 right now is 3.0 undercover."

Pulling isn't cheap (or easy), and they guy with the most money usually wins (and if not, generally has an advantage). That is indisputable.

The problem myself and others have with it is there is NOW/CURRENTLY very little cost difference between 2.6, 2.8, and OEM drivetrain 3.0.

Some don't require as much safety in 2.6, but most do. That being said to be on TOP in National 2.6 pulls (where duel fuelers are allowed), you have spent just as much money on axles, driveshafts, motor, fueling, safety equipment, suspension, etc., and just about the only difference is turbo's and injectors and price differences of those components between classes is not that much (at least from what I have seen between 2.6 and 2.8).

Some say 2.6 turbos are cheaper therefore the class is cheaper, but I suspect many guys haven spent more on their custom 2.6 chargers than those in 2.8....

Motorsports is not cheap, but it should be cheap enough AT THE BOTTOM to encourage new pullers to start and/or step up a level. Many don't want to look at it this way, but 2.6 is at the bottom. Yes, Workstock and most brush pulls are lower, but 2.6 is the bottom for organized pulling. Yes let the big classes spend their inheritence as that is what many like to see, but give the sport an opportunity to GROW instead of stunting it.

The funny thing is there are those that complain about others people's agendas but they seem to have their own (even if they don't realize it). People talk about those who are crying, but there are some in 2.6 who have spent a ton of dough to dominate a beginner class and they seem to cry the most.

Not directed towards anyone in particular: Before thinking about what should or shouldn't be a rule, please look at the ramifications for those wanting to get into the sport. Think about the 17 year old who doesn't stand in Daddy's pockets and wants to compete. He's pulled a few times at brush pulls and has done OK and wants to step up in a year or two to competitive organized pulling. Rules should allow him to get into the sport and do well enough to want to strive for more (and be reachable). I'm not saying he should win his first years out (actually he shouldn't as he doesn't have seat time or experience), but he shouldn't get his ass handed to him by 150' either if he gives an honest effort.

Right now without spending a TON of money, there is no chance of doing well in most areas of the country in 2.6 and that is not good for the sport *bdh*

Edit: As I've said before the 2.6 classes have been good for the sport as it has allowed many "nobody's" to become "somebody's" and gather interest in the sport. The problem is with the influx and competition it has raised the bar for what is average (or the norm) and started putting it out of reach. As it gets furthur out of reach (from a dollar perspective) and in this economy, there is going to be a point where people don't take the plunge into pulling which is unfortunate. We don't need to make it an "everybody plays" or "everybody wins" sport, but be concious of putting it out of reach for the willing....


Is there a national gasser class that is entry level?

I don't see the sport continuing to grow like it has the last 5 years. Run the 2.6 and develop a class under it for others, say a 2.5 or a 2.4 that limits trucks to an s300 based turbo or something in that size family.

I don't think your gonna have a national class that targets entry level folks. If they have the money to travel, they probably have the money to put into the truck!
 
Hmm. So PTE takes a Garrett designed wheel that is made in cast and Billet already....they made a small change to their liking and now its custom. Another company takes the GTX wheel makes some changes to their liking and its a knockoff?? BTW, the GTX wheels are copies of the Rajay B-flow....so
you might want to get informed 1st.:doh:

If the copies and variations are done in the good graces of the original company I see no issues. I don't get that impression from this. Comparing a Rayjay B flow with a GTX? Really? B-flow is really old tech. They made them for Corvairs and such. Neat little turbo. But with straight near vertical blade and no helix at all comparing them to a GTX is a wishful stretch.


They use the GT42 turbine without the stub shaft, Garrett didn't make it, so in your words it is a "knock off". I guess you could say the same thing about Turbonetics, or Bullseye Power.

Good try. That is not a GT42 center. I know what it is I sent it to them. Do they use GT42s. I bet they do but the pics I posted are not of a GT42.

My fishing trip is done. I found out what I needed to know. I was hoping I would find something else.
 
Good try. That is not a GT42 center. I know what it is I sent it to them. Do they use GT42s. I bet they do but the pics I posted are not of a GT42.

They do use a copy of the GT42 turbine section, like I stated, I made no claims about the unit you have. Again, in your description this would also be considered a "knock off". So basically you are saying it is unconstitutional to run a "knock off" charger, yet you do, ironic is it not? The only way to use something that is not a copy or variation of one form or another is to use a stock piece, so I don't see your point.
 
The 2.6 class has blown up over the past few years and taken over where the 2.8 left off. Well, guess what, what governed the 2.8 class is now doing the same to the 2.6 - stock driveline. All the guys out front are hitting a wall and giving the rest of the class a chance to catch up. Give it another year and the 5 trucks out front will be joined by 5 more to compete, and so on.



Either accept being in 10th place out of 30, or stay in WS or keep brush pulling. I built a truck for 2.6 and it's not keeping up. That just fuels my fire more to beat the guy with more in his motor than I have in my truck, trailer and tow truck. I may not ever get there, but even if it's for a very brief moment, it will make it all worth it and I will be drinking like a Comp D moderator that night.:rockwoot:

Do we need more WS classes back - YES! Do we need another rule change again - NO! Get off the internet and work on your trucks!!

No, the same 3 or 4 put 40 feet on the field here in Ohio that I see week in and week out. Should we change the rules so instead of battling for 5th, we boot them out so we can battle for 1st and feel all warm and fuzzy that we won a pull that we tailored to fit our trucks? Don't think so, my last name isn't Scheid.:hehe:

I don't know who this guys is, but he sees the big picture and speaks wisely.


Kevin, I have watched a gasser trash class in NW PA grind itself down to NOTHING, because they did not want to change a rule or two to go along with larger clubs in the area.

Were their rules that good? No, they were rules designed to keep other trucks out-and they succeeded. The result? 4 trucks are left on good days,That is the attitude you have always had, and it is attitudes like yours that are bad for the sport.

The more places that follow the same rules, the BETTER it is for everybody.

Are NADM rules the best out there? Surely not, but they are designed to get as many trucks on the same page as possible, and go 50 states.

I have 3 calls on 2.6- 2 for no change-from winners, and one for change, a top 10 truck who voted for Obama.

I don't see NADM changing 2.6 ....yet. I think we'll let Kentucky and southern Ohio deal with the growing pains of downsizing a turbo rule.

But it is up to the pullers.

3.0 is coming in 2011...
 
LOL U dont need to worry about Ky boys Gene no wonder u wont show up here cause Tom would book a show at the same time then u wouldnt have no show
 
LOL U dont need to worry about Ky boys Gene no wonder u wont show up here cause Tom would book a show at the same time then u wouldnt have no show

Thats the last concern I have. :hehe:

History is destined to repeat itself on that whole deal, good luck to you noobs in Kentucky.
 
LOL true it could happen , but look were u come from good things come to an end sometime
 
BTW, the GTX wheels are copies of the Rajay B-flow....so you might want to get informed 1st.:doh:

Here you are spreading your same old BS yet again....the above statement is completely false.

If you can really make that kind of outlandish statement, then everything else you say should be taken with a grain of salt.
 
Thats the last concern I have. :hehe:

History is destined to repeat itself on that whole deal, good luck to you noobs in Kentucky.

Exactly, we found out up here, i feel for you guys in Ky, but you will find out soon enough how great your beloved Tom McConnell is.
 
I love how everyone is complaining that the 2.6 guys are running insanely expensive 3.0 turbos with custom housings to dominate the "entry level" class.

Around here most guys I know step up to S400's because they are cheaper than the S300 stuff and work better. One of the most popular S300 based chargers a few years ago was the silver bullet, a 66/74 that goes for around $2k because its mixed and matched parts to be a direct replacement on the cummins. I could buy 2 S400's for that much, and still have money left over.

I know some guys are gonna be spending more on billet wheels, or spending the big money custom machining to contour the wheels and make them protrude into the inducer bore. But placing more limits on the turbo is gonna make its even more expensive to build a charger for the class, and once again, the same deep pockets will be putting it on the rest of the field. And the same cry babies will still cry about how they can't compete with the "cheaters"
 
Regardless of what the inducer is, innovative types will always create a better mousetrap and beat you with it. A lot of times, innovation takes money. That will never ever change.

The only hope for a "budget" class is a "spec" charger.

I doubt a "spec" charger concept will ever work, because I have yet to see a large enough group of people who want it. They've done it in tractors, and it seems like it works, so....just get a mass of people who think they want that, and push it, and it'll fly. Until then, I don't see anything changing.

I don't think the NADM 2.6 rules are perfect, but thank God they're not being changed all the damn time. Stability, I can live with.
 
I know some guys are gonna be spending more on billet wheels, or spending the big money custom machining to contour the wheels and make them protrude into the inducer bore. But placing more limits on the turbo is gonna make its even more expensive to build a charger for the class, and once again, the same deep pockets will be putting it on the rest of the field. And the same cry babies will still cry about how they can't compete with the "cheaters"

:thankyou2:
 
I'd like to go on record and state that I hates Ninja pirates with lasers and ****.
 
Regardless of what the inducer is, innovative types will always create a better mousetrap and beat you with it. A lot of times, innovation takes money. That will never ever change.

The only hope for a "budget" class is a "spec" charger.

I doubt a "spec" charger concept will ever work, because I have yet to see a large enough group of people who want it. They've done it in tractors, and it seems like it works, so....just get a mass of people who think they want that, and push it, and it'll fly. Until then, I don't see anything changing.

I don't think the NADM 2.6 rules are perfect, but thank God they're not being changed all the damn time. Stability, I can live with.

I agree.

I know LOTS of people hush this topic but what about the cheapest and easiest way to restrict air (restrictor plates). Hell, even NASCAR does it. They had problems trying to limit carbs and intakes (and guys spent money and got creative) and it was a tech nightmare (much like turbo restrictions), then they went with restrictor plates.

Why can't we do a similar thing. Restrictor tubes in the intake. A Tube (spec tube if need be), needs to be plumbed into the intake stream. It has to be X maximum ID, X minimum length (at that ID), and be placed X/Y distance from the turbo inlet with no other areas for air entry between it and the turbo and be sealed tight to the turbo inlet.

Simple, effective, easy to tech (with a pair of calipers) and it doesn't matter what turbo you run. Changing an intake system is a hell of a lot easier than changing a turbo. Also jumping classes would be easier (just have another section of intake to swap in/out). I'm willing to bet large chargers will have a hard time sucking through straws and will elimate large chargers in small classes........
 
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