Dyno testing,

Hamilton Cams said:
Finished runs on 5 cams. The 232/252 did not want to light on the dyno with the eddy brake on.



Zach
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This is the one I would have really liked to see a comparison too, as to how much bottom end was lost, and by the sounds of it LOTS.
 
same here, I was curious about the results of the 232/252 too.

However, a cam with that much duration doesn't really have any business in a truck setup for the street, therefore the comparison would be somewhat misguided. I guess the test did atleast show that LOL
 
We have it on a puller with a s475 and it lit twice as fast as a small cam because of the volumes of air it puts through the engine. Pulling from 1500rpm up with eddy brakes and so much duration is not a good test for this cam. To be honest our other cams are made for one purpose. They are designed to make as much power as they can, accelerate through each gear well, and clear as much smoke as they can by coming on early . Progressively as cam duration increases, the rpm range for power increases.

The 232/252 was designed for a purpose quite the opposite. It was meant to be started at 5,000+ plus to light the chargers, and they pulled down to the rpm it will run down the track. It is definitely meant for standard pullers and it works well. For autos you will still want to accelerate through the gear, starting from a much lower rpm.

By no means are these cams perfect, we are still tweaking!

Zach
 
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Hamilton Cams said:
The 232/252 was designed for a purpose quite the opposite. It was meant to be started at 5,000+ plus to light the chargers, and they pulled down to the rpm it will run down the track. It is definitely meant for standard pullers and it works well.
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Exactly.
 
GREAT info! :clap::clap: :pop:

one question i had Zach is how much efficiency does the 188/220 lose compared to the 181? do you think there would be a big difference in fuel economy? i want to run the 188 when i get the cash to do it and the truck is my DD.
 
Hamilton Cams said:
The last thing I want is to kick that hornets nest. If I post up which cams they are then this thread will go to hell.
Sold as a drop in cam and a flycut .080" street strip cam, both are very popular. I will remove all of the markings. Both customers they were sold to were told they were new cams, they are regrinds and that is the reason

If i have to disclose whose they are to sell them, I will just destroy them.
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Ya, that's why I thought you might want to PM it, I understand your reasons.

-Dustin-
 
some 98 cummins said:
GREAT info! :clap::clap: :pop:

one question i had Zach is how much efficiency does the 188/220 lose compared to the 181? do you think there would be a big difference in fuel economy? i want to run the 188 when i get the cash to do it and the truck is my DD.
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In some instances it will actually gain efficiency but in most it will loose if you have correctly sized injectors and your charger is not too big.

Think about it this way. If you have a 181/210 that spools good but you are way overfueled and your charger is too big you will still have black smoke. Going with the 188/220 and giving up a few degrees of crank rotation the pressure should be acting on the piston to spool the charger is much more beneficial than opening it later and sitting there in a cloud of smoke not going anywhere.

Running down the road at 65 is a different story. In some of the test trucks I have seen around 75 degree variations at some points in the testing. It is not a major difference but I wanted to make it aware for all of those who have MPG and EGT as their number 1 priority.

It is still a much more conservative exhaust than our competition's cams.

Zach
 
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Hamilton Cams said:
In some instances it will actually gain efficiency but in most it will loose if you have correctly sized injectors and your charger is not too big.

Think about it this way. If you have a 181/210 that spools good but you are way overfueled and your charger is too big you will still have black smoke. Going with the 188/220 and giving up a few degrees of crank rotation the pressure should be acting on the piston to spool the charger is much more beneficial than opening it later and sitting there in a cloud of smoke not going anywhere.

Running down the road at 65 is a different story. In some of the test trucks I have seen around 75 degree variations at some points in the testing. It is not a major difference but I wanted to make it aware for all of those who have MPG and EGT as their number 1 priority.

It is still a much more conservative exhaust than our competition's cams.

Zach
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thanks for the info Zach! ya its my dd but im not as concerned about fuel economy as much as i am wanting a really nice running truck. i know you are probably going to say then run the 181/210 but when i do switch i only want to do it one more time and be done with it. so go big or go home right? i guess the way i look at it is if im buying the new billet, i might as well go a little bigger so i don't regret it someday and say to myself sh!t i wish i had gone bigger that first time.

sorry another rook question i have is will a big cam like the 188 cause any premature wear because of the high lift?
 
So the only real disadvantage of a 188/220 from a 181/210 is a 75* difference cruising down the road?

Have any feedback of that egt difference when going from a stock 12v cam to the 181/210?

Is the initial lag going to be the same or is the 188/220 quicker than the 181/210?

I am looking for less lag and less egt's here at 5,500 ft.
 
THat is such a loaded question. THe 188/220 has slightly higher egt due to the fact that the exhaust opens a little sooner. That has another disadvantage. Our engines are such that they are designed to create pressure that acts on the piston. Taking pressure off of the piston is not cool in that it robs horsepower. If you are after maximum efficiency and you have a conservative turbo and fueling the 181/210 is your best bet. Another thing if power is your main goal many times opening the exhaust slightly sooner spools the chargers earlier which can achieve a net gain in power even thoug you are releasing more pressure to the tail pipe.

Most people have turbos that are too large to spool without making smoke. Programming as far as it has come is still lacking and not 100% perfect. THis fact combined with large injectors means smoke. In this instance, the larger exhaust and slightly earlier echaust opening will create more efficiency because it allows your turbo to spool earlier and clean up the smoke. It is not a big nasty grind just a slightly bigger brother to the 181/210 that trades small amounts of efficiency for better power. as far as fuel economy, many might not notice any difference. Others that are tweaked to fuel economy maximum will see a small drop.

The 181/210 usually sees 100-300 degree egt reductions over stock cams.


Zach
 
What was the accident with the 188? how did it get broke into two pieces?

Great info! just wish I had a hamilton now....uhg! lol
 
Somone forgot to check lash after a minute of runtime. There was a spec of wooden dowel in the lifter still. On the last run the wood left the lifter, created a lot of lash and exploded the lifter face, wiped the exhaust lobe. Upon removal it got dropped (thrown). Lash was checked and rechecked on the rest.
I know ifs and buts don't count but with half an exhaust lobe gone it still made 688. I'm thinking it had a few more ponies in it on all six healthy exhaust lobes. If we weren't an hour and a half from the shop we would have run to get another.
 
When are you going to test the Dmax cams? I would hate to be your mechanic on that dayLOL
 
We have 6 different people doing testing. We will get all of the data, just not on the same truck on the same day.

Zach
 
Zach, When I put you and Garmon on the phone together, I guess it went well...!!

He's going to put you cam ( in think you sent 188, right? ) in his 12v drag truck and test it stock vs. new..... Should be interesting!!

You can thank me later!!!! lol
 
Haha, Thank you. I think he has seen way to many negative results with aftermarket cams and crazy valve timing. These tests were done with a very similar engine setup, so he should be happy. I am going to try and give him an edge on the race if I can, we have some new goodies coming in soon.


Zach
 
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Hamilton Cams said:
The 181/210 usually sees 100-300 degree egt reductions over stock cams.


Zach
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Thats about spot on...I saw a little over 200 degrees of EGT reduction on my 97 12v for the most part, but on some big grades I saw my EGTS drop over 300 degrees when pulling my trailer compared to doing the same thing with the stock cam.

One of the biggest things I noticed was the ability to spool up a bigger charger with out having to throw a ton of fuel at it to make it light quick. That helped out my fuel economy, EGT and also made my truck quicker.
 
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