Stroke oil in diesel fuel

SixOhh said:
http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/76-speciality-forums/64-maintenance-fluids/177728-lubricity-additive-study-results.html

Optilube is the most expensive /per tank, but that is a small price to pay if your injectors and pump last another 50k if you ask me.


.... its a good read regardless. check it out
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Not to *bdh* but the chosen mix ratios greatly affect the product performance. The test list 200:1 for 2 stroke but that means they are at .64 oz/gal (128 oz/gal) which is a off number to field measure. Mopar Man runs a 128:1 which makes logic sense or even a 256:1 (1/2 oz) would make sense.

Power Service is listed at 400:1 and the 32 oz bottle treats 100 gallons so that comes out to .32oz/gal or 128/.32 = 400:1. However, what if PS was run at 1/2oz a gallon, what would the scores be in comparison?

There are products that are better then others but more curious as to how the proper use or alteration affects performance.
 
Nighthawk said:
Not to *bdh* but the chosen mix ratios greatly affect the product performance. The test list 200:1 for 2 stroke but that means they are at .64 oz/gal (128 oz/gal) which is a off number to field measure. Mopar Man runs a 128:1 which makes logic sense or even a 256:1 (1/2 oz) would make sense.

Power Service is listed at 400:1 and the 32 oz bottle treats 100 gallons so that comes out to .32oz/gal or 128/.32 = 400:1. However, what if PS was run at 1/2oz a gallon, what would the scores be in comparison?

There are products that are better then others but more curious as to how the proper use or alteration affects performance.
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Unofficially I gotten numbers for 128:1 ratio 2 cycle in the 380 to 420 HFRR realm.

As for PS it really easy first off put a sample of PS in a open container and let it stand. Now tell me what you get in about a week? It should be a brown sticky tar like substance. Now if you do the same thing to 2 cycle oil you still have 2 cycle oil even after 1 week. So the point is if you add more oil the lubricity is going to improve. But if you add more solvent its going to get poorer. This is why PS score is so low in the first place the product is mostly cetane booster which wipes out the BTU's and make MPG's lower.

Like saying I'm going to improve my engine oil with gasoline... :doh:
 
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Mopar1973Man said:
Unofficially I gotten numbers for 128:1 ratio 2 cycle in the 380 to 420 HFRR realm.

As for PS it really easy first off put a sample of PS in a open container and let it stand. Now tell me what you get in about a week? It should be a brown sticky tar like substance. Now if you do the same thing to 2 cycle oil you still have 2 cycle oil even after 1 week. So the point is if you add more oil the lubricity is going to improve. But if you add more solvent its going to get poorer. This is why PS score is so low in the first place the product is mostly cetane booster which wipes out the BTU's and make MPG's lower.

Like saying I'm going to improve my engine oil with gasoline... :doh:
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Hmm, I will empty the last few oz of the PS into a open container for diesel science. In reality though, just to :poke: fun, using PS even though it scored low is better then not using anything. LOL

I do have some tw3 laying around from the boat but i may have to put it in the PS bottle so people in the fuel station don't stare. I already know you will disagree but I will bounce back to 2-stroke with a 256:1 first.

By the way, for others reading, something helpful that i use to make sure i am not under/over mixing is a Ratio Rite (see link below).

http://www.motosport.com/dirtbike/RATIO-RITE-MEASURING-CUP
 
I use a old quart bottle with the clear line in it. Pump my fuel. Then if I pumped 14 gallons I just add 14 ounces. No big science or need for a ratio cup. But for those who fill up and add a full quart each time better be pumping 32 gallons or more. When I'm filling up its like 20-25 gallons rarely have I've even been close to 30 gallons. I live way too far from a fuel station to play the 1/8 tank game. At a 1/2 tank I'm typically heading to town...

On occasion I'll do a tank clearing. Add nothing wash the tank out with a clear load of diesel then next load add the 2 cycle oil and now I know my ratios are in check still.

Yes... I've logged every drop of fuel since ~20k miles to current...
rupl4n.jpg
 
Mopar Man, I like your posts and appreciate the information you share, but I have a science question for you. How does adding cetane booster destroy the BTU content of the fuel? In science we learn about conservation of momentum, conservation of energy, etc. For an additive to lower the BTU content it would have to create an exothermic reaction (produce heat in the tank that can then be shed off into the surrounding environment and transform BTU content of fuel into external thermal energy that is radiated away). I agree fully that adding a lower BTU content additive can displace or thin-out the denser fuel and thereby lower the measured BTU content of an individual gallon, but the total BTU content of the fuel tank increases when you add any type of fuel additive, which is why I think it's misleading to state that Power Service or other additives lower the BTU content of the fuel.
 
@Mopar1973Man, is there any issue with putting the two cycle oil in the tank and then letting the truck sit for two weeks? I work or of town often and my truck won't move for sometimes more than two weeks, this fuel/oil wouldn't separate or all fall down to the bottom or anything like that would it?
 
No it will not separate. Once diesel fuel mixes with 2 cycle oil it stays mixed just like 2 cycle oil and gasoline it stays mixed.

Now the only fuel that will separate and become a problem is BioDiesel and its really common for the Bio part of the fuel to separate and settle to the bottom and harden like old bacon grease. So as long as you use normal petroleum diesel fuel there is no problem of separation.
 
Awesome! I will be starting my diesel/2 cycle regimen on this next tank! Although it may take me a month go through a full tank to get accurate readings... but! I'll be starting it when my current tank is empty...
 
Just thought I would complete the loop via update:

So far have gone 300 miles at a 1/2oz per gallon mix ratio and power/fuel economy seem the same as before when running power service. One note was by a friend who said my truck during idle/cruising down the road is "deeper and/or more refined" then before, which follows the logic of a slower burn cycle/flame front (although minor) pointed out by Moparman.

However, one drawback in my book is the burn seems "sooty-er" then before but not in reference to smoke content. My truck being air mods on stock electronics to a mild timing/duration chip is smoke free but evidence can be found around the tailpipe edge. I wipe the tailpipe during every wash (say once a month) which is about 500 to 600 miles if I am lucky. At 300 miles, i have the same "burned edge look" as if i had more then double the miles. just my $.02 observation.

I have been using penz tw3 and will be switching to a low ash or ashless 2-cycle oil for fill-ups next purchase.
 
Since the fuel burns slower you have to keep RPM's down low to optimize the burn. Excessive RPM's will take you out of optimal burn rate. Like my truck maxes out MPG's at about 1,600-1,700 RPM's (or 55-60 MPH) on flat ground. Also you have to tune your defueling to allow optimal boost usage like myself I use to run 5x5 still making good MPG's but 5x3 is much better and cleaner for daily driving. Very very rare to see soot.

Like the world largest diesel engine turns a mere 102 RPM's at redline but produces a huge amount of HP/TQ (5,608,310 lbf·ft) but the fuel is extremely low cetane more like liquid tar. So you have to balance the cetane to what you plan on doing. If you plan on being above 2K most of the time back off the 2 cycle oil a bit more allowing the cetane to rise. But 200:1 is the leanest you want to go. Then 100:1 is the richest you want to go.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W%C3%A4rtsil%C3%A4-Sulzer_RTA96-C
 
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I just finished off my first gallon of Super Tech outboard oil, so 128 gallons mixed at 128 to 1. A slight increase in mileage, 1/2 to 1 MPG, but it's all been combined driving, in town, highway, towing the boat. I'd need to take a long highway trip empty to see true results. I've gotten 21 MPG without the stroke, but winter fuel will be here before I get a chance to burn a tank empty on the highway. I'll try the 5x3 setting and see what I get. Normally I get 16.8 to 17.5 combined driving, lots of city. I should have checked it towing the boat to the Columbia for salmon. 354 miles round trip and I did it 3 times this fall, but I can't help coming home at 70 after a long day :D. 17 mpg on those trips with the boat around 3500 lbs, truck 7200, 3 people in the truck, probably 200lbs of gear, Juice on 3x2.
 
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Just finished my first tank, previous tank w/ no treatment 16.16 mpg, this tank w/ treatment 16.67... gonna keep using to establish a better data set, but! So far so good
 
(Shaking my head)

I really do wonder how people can make a MPG number that close. None of mine are even close to each other. I work with my truck for living so I might haul trailers, might haul heavy loads, I might drive empty, heck even mother nature might blow wind even worse I might get a combination all the above.

200,000 miles of logs.
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Stats...
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All I do is account for the mileage driven via the trip odometer taking into account the larger diameter tire, divided by the gallons pumped, also bringing the fuel back to the same point, the decimals I know are rather unnecessary, but I like them, although I do understand that they are not indicative of many variables that I can not account for, windage, idle time in traffic, various weight differences be it big or small, but! As I mentioned before, that was only my first tank, like yourself I will do this over many fuel cycles to establish my own findings, hopefully I come to the same conclusions! Thank you again so much for your research! I hope I start to get better mileage over time like yourself
 
I highly suggest to use GPS to track miles. Like my truck I'm off by 0.5 MPH and my odometer is off by about 20-30 miles per tank. So if you look at the graph you'll see 26.12 MPG hand calculated using odometer then if you use my ScanGauge correct odometer you come up with 27.2 MPG.

As for doing offset calculations I highly suggest again it being just change a wheel size the tire profile could be alerted and change once again the calculation.

Funny part is my error is from changing from stock 265's to 235's which is 1 rev per mile different or 0.5 MPH.

Trust me you find the GPS miles different from your calculated miles.

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IDK "how" you are able to break 20 + mpg on such a consist basis unless your going like 55mph. Since purchased i have roughly kept track of mileage and i am 18mpg unloaded and 13mpg loaded down (sub 10k).
 
the wind resistance between 55 mph and 60 mph would actually surprise you. 55 is ideal, but hard to maintain for me. i find myself going 70 in 55's, and that will drop your fuel mileage significantly
 
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